MyHeritage -- Snaps Up Geni.com

Started by Peter Rohel on Wednesday, November 28, 2012

Participants:

Profiles Mentioned:

Showing 61-90 of 228 posts
12/2/2012 at 5:55 AM

Well, I live in South Africa and became a member of both Geni and Myheritage at some cost to me, since our money is not worth much in the international scene - I would like to know how the merger is going to affect me and what benefits (if any - says my cinical self) will accrue via the merger. For me mergers and acquisitions mean only one thing - more money making for someone on the take?

Photo_silhouette_m_thumb2
Private User
12/2/2012 at 7:23 AM

Ok Beth, so you don't think the analogy works, but you don't explain why.
Why does it not work for a service? My main point is that people naturally get upset when prices for products or services they have already purrchased go down.
But who am I to tell you why you are upset, or that you shouldn't be as upset?
So I will not argue this anymore.

What I will do is share a thread where apparently Geni users were asking for non-paying members to be allowed to accept merge requests:
http://www.geni.com/discussions/101533

That thread is a year old, but I believe it shows there is certainly value (to some members at least) in allowing non-pating members more rights for three merging.

Again Beth, I respect how you feel, but I truly see this change as beneficial to all.
Side note: I believe as well that Geni is responding with this announcement to a competitor's threat, since FamilyTree.org has announced free tree merging and a free tree creaing software (very basic at the moment, BTW)

Private User
12/2/2012 at 7:32 AM

It all depends on which side of the divide you're on. If you paid, you're upset because you paid for something that is worth less now than when you decided to buy it. But if you DIDN'T pay, you're happy because the privileges that they took away from you when they decided to make them Pro options are now available again. There is NOTHING they could do that would make both groups happy. Frankly, I'm in the second group, and I am glad to see they did it.

12/2/2012 at 8:55 AM

Sure. There is something they can do. They can either add an additional benefit to the Pro accounts to replace what is now free OR they can reduce the price. (all things you can't do with a tangible item such as a car) I'm betting on the first thing and hopefully we will see some of this soon as the merger with My Heritage rolls on.

As for wanting everyone to be able to merge, I stand by my thoughts on that :)

12/2/2012 at 9:00 AM

Im a PRO member and Im really happy that geni finally have decided that everyone can accept a merge.

When I try to merge profiles, the other user has to accept it, but without being pro a lot of profiles and trees will still be duplicates. So im happy
for this change..

I believe there will still be worth it to be a PRO, but time will show.
Dont know much about Heritage yet, but I believe that as members
we can benefit from it ;)

Private User
12/2/2012 at 2:27 PM

"Accept a merge" - Is that the same as being able to merge?

12/2/2012 at 4:20 PM

Being able to merge and "accepting a merge" are two very different actions.
As i understand it BASIC users have always been able to accept merges, the new changes mean that BASIC users can now request merges, which was the way things worked before the rules changed late in 2011.
Despite the fact that i am a PRO and the service i have paid for is now devalued slightly i'm not the least worried by that, the benefit to all users that comes with BASIC users having more abilities far out ways this "loss". The real "losers" are actually the Lifetime members as i can just cancel my payments and revert to a free account :)

I'm more interested in merging between MyHeritage Trees and Geni or at least importing MyHeritage data into The Tree, but there doesn't seem to be much talk of merging the sites, only matching searrches, etc.
I have relatives that left Geni because of the limit to tree size for Basc members, since then she has extended our tree beyond what is here on Geni and also made contact with several other people with overlapping trees on MyHeritage. I have access to her tree and thru her to their trees but frankly the idea of cutting and pasting from that site to Geni has no appeal what so ever. This relative actually preferred Geni over MyHeritage but wasn't willing to pay to go PRO, since she has built her tree on MyHeritage there is little incentive for her to move back to Geni even though it is now free again.

12/2/2012 at 6:37 PM

Well, Alex, how long do you think it is going to be free again?

Private User
12/2/2012 at 7:00 PM

Alex you're talking about a "bridge" between MyHeritage trees and Geni trees. Amanda says in the FAQ it is being looked at but could take a few years.

12/2/2012 at 7:59 PM

"Bridge" is fine by me, it has to be called something :)
So the connection between the two sites means that we will get a lot more Tree Matches and hopefully the quality of these matches will be improved by the MyHeritage software, BUT how will those new matches be useful if we cannot merge trees between the two sites?
Last week i had a free account at MyHeritage and i could look at "my" family tree that was being built there, presumably i will soon be notified of a Tree Match between that tree and the Tree here on Geni. What then? How has the situation changed any with the new ownership?

Also, if the new Tree Match software starts comparing all the isolated MyHeritage trees against Geni's Tree then surely there is going to be a mountain of Matches to wade thru!

If, or when, this Bridge comes about it seems to me that it would be equivalent to a massive gedcom import with all the duplicates that would entail, especially if MyHeritage is mostly isolated trees and could have alot of duplication.

Private User
12/2/2012 at 11:41 PM

Alex Geni and MyHeritage are separate companies. They will look at ways to take advantage of their business relationship, in the interests of both users bases ... And maximizing profit of course. :)

I've already looked a little at MH trees thru search and it's all the same stuff as Ancestry trees and FTM sites and so on. What i hope to take advantage of is RECORD matches so Geni can continue to build a well sourced and world tree organized world tree.

12/3/2012 at 8:28 AM

Randy Schoenberg - thank you for adding your legal expertise to the Private vs Public discussion:
http://www.geni.com/discussions/80793?msg=835419

Private tree owners - continue to try to Scare everyone with Incorrect facts - so they can Control what they think is - only Their tree on Geni. This, even when their branch, is part of the 1 Big tree.

We do Not know "yet" (coming in future months) what GENI's New Rules will be - as to Profiles of Dead people.

Glad to hear Geni's focus will be: "Geni.com will remain focused on building a single family tree of the world".
http://help.geni.com/entries/22475611-how-will-the-two-websites-ope...

Now that Geni exists in name & location only - is part of a New company with their old Rules & will develop New ones - the Private vs Public of Dead people profiles - can Finally be resolved, at least I hope :)

12/3/2012 at 8:32 AM

Peter Rohel *cheers to that! :))

Private User I agree and would love to see Geni get back to supporting finding records at least somewhere ;)

Private User
12/3/2012 at 8:40 AM

Alex if I really want to and work on a good computer from an easy to read source, I can easily enter 100 profiles in a couple of hours, I'm really not seeing the dire need for data interchange.

But I always see the need for better researched, documented & presented trees.

Private User
12/3/2012 at 9:13 AM

It's so very right what Erica Isabel Howton writes above: "But I always see the need for better researched, documented & presented trees."
- And that will be a great problem in the future in merging profiles.
I wonder why lots of public profiles appears without places of birth etc.

Photo_silhouette_f_thumb2
Private User
12/3/2012 at 9:41 AM

Naude Visser b2c12d1e3f10g1h8i5j2k4 You may find our FAQ's about the announcement helpful: http://help.geni.com/forums/21545466-things-to-know

Private User
12/3/2012 at 10:41 AM

Henny

The original "historic" Geni tree was populated with GEDCOM uploads, not so much "hand built" entries. We've been trying to weave together all the duplicates into merged profiles, designate them as Masters, and get them documented and correct. We've come a long way in that mission in the last couple of years, I'm quite proud of everyone's contributions, and expect they continue.

For "closer to now" trees it's really about the manager, isn't it? And of course we may only have limited information with research on going and welcome from our collaborators.

Photo_silhouette_m_thumb2
Private User
12/3/2012 at 11:12 AM

Private User if it were some one who was born 300 years ago i can see why they wouldn't put place of birth or date because A it can get a bit tricky B maybe they don't exactly know where as the further back you get. as for prior to 1880 to present day i can see why they would want it private for concerns of ex spouses identity thieves etc etc

Private User
12/3/2012 at 12:06 PM

Michael McCann - In Denmark we have access to the churchbooks back in the 1600s. So information about places of birth and death is available online for free. Just laying there to be picked up by the profile manager.

--------

Erica - I'll stay quiet from now on :-) I'm quite sure you all have focus on the problems.

Private User
12/3/2012 at 12:53 PM

Henny

We don't have church books in the US. Even in the 20th century it can be very difficult to find information about birth, death, and places. When it's our own grand parents, what can we do? We enter what we know and keep searching ....

Private User
12/3/2012 at 12:54 PM

Henny

But feel free to yell at those who aren't entering data that IS easily known! :):)

Photo_silhouette_f_thumb2
Private User
12/3/2012 at 3:10 PM

Alex Moes - No, Basic Users were NOT able to accept mergers - the only exception being for their own claimed profile - if they accepted an invitation to a Tree, using the e-mail they had already established on another Tree, they could accept the request to merge the two versions of their own profile. BUT they COULD NOT accept mergers on any other profiles they managed and/or that were within their family group.

And many, many Pros complained about this and requested it be changed, because it definitely hampered what they wanted to do.

Private User
12/3/2012 at 7:31 PM

I understand this may be of topic but my question concerns Geni and MH .... Would someone please give me the definition of what is considered a private tree in Geni. Private trees in Geni appear to be frowned on and if MH also has them won't' the problem still exist. A definition would really help ..... I have read some strong opininions most against private trees .... no privacy, privacy on minors only, privacy by generations etc. I am just trying to get it straight in order to make a decision ...... Thanks

12/3/2012 at 7:42 PM

Dave,
It really varies depending on who is posting and what they are discussing.
Some people refer to private trees in the sense that they are not connected to The Big Tree (i prefer to call these Isolated Trees) but there is nothing to stop every profile in an Isolated Tree having it's privacy settings set to Public.
Another connotation is that if you are part of The Big Tree you can make the profiles that immediately surround you (your Family Group) to Private, so that while they are still part of the Big Tree they cannot be seen by others.

Clear as mud?

12/3/2012 at 7:47 PM

Lois,

If what you describe is correct then that was a terrible thing to do to the Basic users.
I can accept not allowing Basics to start merges but if I as a Pro initiate a merge with a Basic user who has an Isolated Tree there would be no way to complete the merge (aside from Family Group invites)!
I'm trying very hard to resist using the word "insane".

Private User
12/3/2012 at 8:47 PM

Alex & Lois - let's end this digression slightly?

1). If a tree is isolated, then "collaboration" (public profiles) or "family group" (private profiles) is needed to join that member's tree to the World Family Tree

2) Basic members were able to accept merges initiated by their collaborators / family group members. Now they can also initiate them.

Back to MyHeritage ...

Private User
12/3/2012 at 8:56 PM

Dave

"I understand this may be of topic but my question concerns Geni and MH .... Would someone please give me the definition of what is considered a private tree in Geni. Private trees in Geni appear to be frowned on and if MH also has them won't' the problem still exist. A definition would really help ..... I have read some strong opininions most against private trees .... no privacy, privacy on minors only, privacy by generations etc. I am just trying to get it straight in order to make a decision ...... Thanks"

I may need to break this out into several posts so bear with me.

1). Alex's term of "isolated tree" is correct. It refers to a tree UN connected to the World Family Tree. See http://www.geni.com/worldfamilytree to watch it tick. :):). You know a tree is isolated when you go to a profile and it shows you: No Path Found

Here's an example:

col john jackson

Now you'll notice: this profile is public, I presume deliberately so, and I also presume is deceased. So this is a function of the manager not yet having yet found a connection to the WFT - and sadly, not yet being offered collaboration.

Private User
12/3/2012 at 9:08 PM

Dave (continued)

Now as I understand MyHeritage trees, they work like Ancestry trees. Everyone has their own and can invite others to join them, but it's a forest of "isolated trees.". This is their business model, has always been, and continues to be.

Geni is more like Wikipedia meets Facebook. There are groupings. Currently it functions to be "trees blending upwards." Or it's a lot easier for me to conceptualize it as an acrostic puzzle. There is "across" (the Family Group, with gaps). There is "down" (for us young whipper snappers, the descendant generations be pretty small in stats). And there is "up" - the ancestral count, or what I would call the Historic Tree. Again, for us young 'uns, we're talking 1900 and back. However there is a privacy zone which can being that zone back as far as 1750 - which to my mind defeats the purpose of collaborative genealogy, as I'm incredibly fortunate to find ANY ancestor that far back (n.b. In fact I was told by family it couldn't be done, so HAH). But ... That's getting into opinion, sorry. :):)

Private User
12/3/2012 at 9:16 PM

Dave (cont'd)

The group for the Geni Family Tree and privacy zone is here
http://www.geni.com/company/privacy

You will notice: Updated on August 11, 2011

Meaning - it was differently defined before then. On fact in my time using Geni it has been refined several times (this is where Lois pipes in ...).

Now my interest is in the historic tree so to be honest I don't pay a great deal of attention to all this, except when cool cats ask interesting questions nicely.

In terms of making a platform decision for me it's always been easy:

1) I like collaborative genealogy.
2) I like history.
3) I don't put anything on the internet I'm not comfortable with anyone seeing, partly because I used to do IT Security, and know everything is hackable - but identity theft is all about credit card batch theft, NOT maiden names.

Hope this helps.

12/3/2012 at 9:21 PM

If identity theft were just about names and dates then things like the LSD database couldn't exist and that would be kinda sad :/

Showing 61-90 of 228 posts

Create a free account or login to participate in this discussion