Merge Mania: "Everything is becoming a mess"

On 10/28/2010, Private stated in the discussion http://www.geni.com/discussions/82935?msg=639628 :

"johnny dee ,what do you mean" merging profiles against peoples will"? profiles are related to a tree at some distinct point in time. either it is true or it is false. should the merge be true then one should not be concerned. if the merge is careless and false then one has every right to be concerned.
everyone must get over the feeling of the tree as personal property. it is not. it is a record of relationships to which we all are connected. 1000's of us all related to the same 20th ggf. he could easily be related to millions of people. hard to make that personal. consequentially when one reaches their 24 gggm and finds all or many of the 'DEAD" relatives marked as private....it is annoying to say the least. only your living family needs to be private and that is not very private. geni is not "facebook" or "twitter"-nor should it be."

Apparently, Johnny Dee is no longer on Geni, so I don't think he can respond to you.

As I noted above, there will be occasions when two or more profile managers cannot agree what information is correct. There needs to be a mechanism whereby these differences can be documented and then we can move on.

I get the impression from some of the comments made in the public discussions, that there are some collaborators who in their zeal to merge as many profiles as possible may have arbitrarily overridden one profile manager's data with another--in some cases incorrectly. Considering the amount of time and effort some profile manager spend on documenting their profiles, you can understand why some profile managers whose information is being overwritten are upset by all of this "merge mania."

Everyone,

I draw your attention to blog.geni.com:

September 15, 2010
Building our shared family tree

"Our mission is to solve the problem of genealogy (the question of how everyone is related) by creating a family tree of the whole world." - Geni CEO David Sacks, January 12, 2007, days before Geni launched to the public.

The goal of Geni has always been to create a shared family tree, so our users around the world can meet new cousins and discover how they relate to historical figures and celebrities. Recently we've taken some steps that have moved us significantly towards this goal.

First, we introduced the new Merge Center, a package of enhancements designed to make merging faster and easier. Since we released the Merge Center, the number of profiles merged every week has almost doubled, and continues to grow.

Then we introduced Curators, a group of users selected by the Geni community to improve and maintain the accuracy of the historical parts of the shared tree. Curators are able to merge and update any public profile. This small group has spent countless hours correcting mistakes and consolidating duplicate branches of the shared tree.

Today we are announcing the next step towards our goal of creating the single most accurate and comprehensive family tree anywhere - Master Profiles. A Master Profile is the standard profile for a given person. Over time, as our Curators and other Geni users continue their work, you will find that Master Profiles are the most comprehensive and accurate profiles for each person. Other profiles for the same person are secondary and should eventually be merged into the Master Profile.

So what does this mean for you? Over the next few months, you should notice the benefits from these and other projects we are working on. The historical parts of your tree will continue to improve in accuracy and completeness. If you are actively working on your tree, please continue to do so. If everyone works on their part of the tree, we'll all have a rich, shared family tree before we know it.

If you aren't yet part of the "big tree" of over 45 Million profiles, keep checking your Merge Center for new Tree Matches and Profile Merges that may connect you. And if you're looking to get more engaged in the Geni community, Public Discussions are a great place to start.

September 15, 2010
Building our shared family tree
http://blog.geni.com

On 10/28/2010 Private User echoed some of my thoughts at http://www.geni.com/discussions/82935?msg=639661 . I have copied them here.

"Dear Jon,

It's not a matter of thinking one owns a tree as a private property. You may see that mine are all public but, I agree that everyone has the right to consider in it the relatives he or she determine as a limit. I do have collaborators, the ones who asked if I'm willing to connect our trees and perfectly do understand that if I see some duplicates or quituple data, or wrong or unbased data, I ask them first to clarify them and the profiles behind the ones they want to merge.before aceeding to do so. Do remember you merge not only a profile but, the ones behind it and the mistakes contained in them will undoubtly have an effect on yours and thus, your family tree. I've had to rebuild some branches several times and even couldn't eliminate duplicates in my own family tree 'cause some profiles, not being father or mother of a determined ancestor is private, locked and can't be removed. As someone said, it's not a matter of not seeing our profiles, but not making changes in it. If somebody has different data is quite easy to contact the manager, tell him or her so and try to find out the correct data together. That's a respectful attitude."

i like dear jon's comments... its fair

Erica, we agree that the "Big Tree" is the ultimate goal. Where we differ is the speed and accuracy with which we aspire to reach that goal.

I do move faster than many. :) Hope you can keep up. :) :)

احمد

Those would be Sylvia's comments, and I agree as well.

Ah, there's nothing like a good conspiracy theory. I haven't been this entertained since the good ol' days on the Geni Forum.

Erica, you may be fast, but are you accurate? And do you document your work?

Joe,

What part of the tree are you working in? I don't run across your profiles so I don't think we're crossing ancestral paths.

And sorry, I had a terrible geni 24 hours, where I was publicly and personally attacked. My complaint window is closed. The help@geni.com line is always open, though.

Happy ancestor hunting.

David, just because someone is paranoid doesn't mean that someone's not out to get that person.

With the number of times that I've gotten the message "We are experiencing technical difficulties," I'm not surprised that someone linked retalliation with criticism. But that's another topic. Let's stay on topic here: Merge Mania.

Joe,

I have a problem when the criticism is misdirected.

Application issues should be addressed to help@geni.com. In discussion we are users helping users, hopefully around genealogy questions, which is the reason we're all here.

And retaliation including stalking is appropriate? Are you serious?

Erica,

Where is the top of the "Big Tree"? Where is the bottom? Where is the middle? I don't know how to tell you where I am in the "Big Tree."

If we still had Geni friends, I could make you a friend and then you could see for yourself where I am. But that's another discussion.

And don't get me started on help@geni.com. I send them a problem almost daily--two today.

Sorry that the Geni community has been so hard on you today. But "sticks and stones can break your bones, but words can never hurt you."

Erica, et al,

I deleted the previous post.

Geni somehow garbled what I wrote. I was trying to ask:

To what are you referring when you say:

"And retaliation including stalking is appropriate? Are you serious?"

.

I'm pretty sure you saw a discussion now deleted. A member of the community was stalked cross the internet. Unbelievable.

I get excellence customer service and timely response from help@geni.com. It probably helps that I'm a PRO user and I use that PRO I paid for on behalf of other people's issues as well.

I'm a volunteer, Joe, cleaning up the tree based on my own ancestral lines, documenting as I can as I go along, and calling on my collaborators to help with that as I can merge more efficiently than most.

It is LACK OF MERGING that caused to collapse of the tree. It is MERGING THE DUPS in that is making the tree more accurate, more detailed, more documented, and more accessible to more.

When analyzing something it helps to have some history and some facts. You're still pretty new to geni. I think you make a few assumptions, not all of which are valid.

Anyway -- my complaint line is closed, as I said. Probably permanently. I'm still shaken from the appalling way I and others were treated on discussions and I'm not going to forget that so quickly. And it is the good people of help@geni.com who put an end to it, which I'm not going to forget so quickly, either.

I have no problem with the Merge issue. I have my tree in other applications so if there is a problem, I have other copies. Now that being said, I thank everyone who has worked on my tree in merging and finding new cousins, relations, and history! There is so much I don't know and I am learning so much just being here and listening. Thank you for your help and your discussions.

Dear joe - Thanks - you just asnwered my Q by accident - "If we still had Geni friends, I could make you a friend and then you could see for yourself where I am. But that's another discussion"

We do need this iption back as I do not want a truck load of collborators - nor do i like the experience of the 'family group' which allows any one who is of that group to edit profiles - - -

What did Geni do with those of us who were linked as 'friends only' put us in to the 'family group" area without warning us ????

Erica, the stalker to which you refer must have been on a discussion which I'm not following, and therefore, did not receieve emails on. I'm sorry s/he upset you so much, but whatever s/he said are only words--they cannot hurt you.

I've noticed that there is a lack of documents supporting the information on Geni--at least in the profiles that I've seen. I've tried to document my profiles, but I'm running into numerous problems--all reported to help@geni.com with limited effective response---I guess I need to upgrade to Pro. (See http://www.geni.com/discussions/82023)

You assert that "It is LACK OF MERGING that caused to collapse of the tree. It is MERGING THE DUPS in that is making the tree more accurate, more detailed, more documented, and more accessible to more."

I don't see how merging equates to accuracy. Inaccurate merging can only lead to more inaccuracy. Profile managers who feel that they are being forced to merge or are being merged over their objections, call into question the accuracy of such merges. In the absence of documents attached to the profiles, I can't understand how a collaborator can determine which information is correct and which is not.

I know you're a volunteer and you're working your hardest to improve the "Big Tree," but merging only improves the tree if it's accurate.

You're correct that I'm relatively new to Geni, but I would appreciate you specifically pointing out the assumptions that I'm making incorrectly so that I can improve my understanding of Geni. Don't worry about hurting my feelings; I have a pretty thick skin.

Judi, the discussion that you seek is at http://www.geni.com/discussions/82935 . It involves a number of Geni users who advocate the reinstating of friends.

You are actually incorrect Joe and that is because of, I submit, your lack of experience on the site.

- The more merges (accurate ones, of course) - the better the data and the better the documentation.

The reason for this is logical if you think about it. I have a bit of info, you have a bit of info, we both put it in our profiles. Merge together: the single profile is twice as good as either standing alone. Keep this up over 40 merges? You begin to have history.

Now I do applaud your use of documentation, and try to do similarly for my closer ancestors (current time back to 1830 or so, United States). I am lucky enough to have an ancestry.com subscription so have some access to reasonable primary sources.

But the historical tree is, roughly, 1800 on back, so the documentation needs / requirements / availability is different.

Before you criticize a profile, find out --

1. who built it
2. what era it's in

And don't use one of mine as an example. I'm just a custodian and you're not interested in my closer relatives (nor are they your business to critique unless I ask).

The path between us shows our common ancestor to be:

unknown Prescott

I know nothing about her and her tree is in danger of collapsing due to outstanding merges that aren't getting done.

Joe, if you want an accurate tree:

1. Collaborate and merge
2. Build the documentation yourself
3. Build the documentation with collaborators / other descendants through use of the Project tool

Don't take potshots.
Don't keep criticizing.
Jump on board and help it get better, and with the tools at hand. They're pretty good ones and improving weekly.

Thank you - been so busy trying to clean up files and get some stuff up - have messe dout on alot here

Joe,

I also explained to you that "sources" are a NEW development to geni, released some six months ago. There is no doubt that the tool needs tweaking, enhancing, and further releases. That is the *nature* of application software. It's an immature piece of the product and *will** improve, but you must have patience for development cycles.

Other aspects of the platform are quite mature and stable. The networks for instance seem pretty good. The messaging piece is coming along.

If you want to play in the web 2.0 space - and for free I might add - you tolerate some change and maturation. You want boring mainframe? I will point you at ancestry.com and their $250 plus annual fee. :)

Sharon Gail Williams

Yes, that's exactly right.

I export my tree regularly to my computer and protect my closer ancestry / personal entries in that way.

The shared data is the shared ancestry, and frankly, it's marvelous.

Dear Erica:

Besides it's a pleasure to meet you as my cousin 20th., I want to tell you that reading your comment of October 28th. popped up some considerations into my mind. The first one, is that Geni's goal it's not necessarily mine as it's not my goal to know or to celebrate if my ancestors were celebrities or historical figures. Some of them, are but that doesn't change the kind of person I'm. My goal is to know about them, my family roots and my attiitude towards them, respect and recognition are the same for both: known or unkonw characters. The second one, is that perhaps due to my personality, I don't want to be standarized nor my ancestors, as I consider every single human being is one and a sole aim and standarization means for me, putting everyone in the same sack. As an example, I never was an standard or typical teacher who just stood up in front of the class and talked about any signature to my pupils. Not at all. I always believed they all had previous experiences of their own and pulled them out so we together arrived to a conclusion or even more, we several times "acted" the subject, if you're introduced in Gestalt line in Psychology, you can understand what I mean. It was essential for us, that everything was a leaving experience, came out spontaneously and that they could freely express their feelings. I used to puzzle them by asking if they were sure I was telling them the truth and not to lay on what I said because I was their "teacher" and thus, the "authority" upon them whose words they shouldn't dare to question.
Perhaps some people data will not be completely correct but, he has the right to if told so, search which is his mistake and correct it by his own. In that way, he'll learn about what he's done. The other, it will be done for him, not requiring any effort from his side. Things obtained without effort, rarely last. It's not a matter of "uniforming" data creating any stratus of experts, that sounds me like Aldous Huxley but, having a good time, get acquainted with your family, dead and alive, and not only your family, but also, good friends. I don't like perfect mechanical ways of doing things, I believe that specialy in what concerns human relations, everything should be humanized. That's why sociology's ways of investigation differe from the cientific ones. They definetily are different fields.
Best regards,
Sylvia.

Funny you should mention Sociology -- I was raised by a pair. And in the 1960s it was intellectually in the vanguard, I believe. Not as vibrant a discipline these days.

I agree that the search is half the fun. But one of the wonderful ways geni is developing -- and I do think they're in the forefront about this -- is through the Project tool.

We can make logical associations and grouping for "ordinary" people involved in "extraordinary events." For example, I have two ancestors (probably more) involved on **different** sides of the Salem Witchcraft Trials. Not something I ever knew and not something I would have been likely to know through "conventional" genealogical methods.

So part of my concept is if a "future Erica" goes on geni, links herself piece by piece through the ancestral forest, and discovers a relationship with Mary Bliss Parsons -- and her profile explains a bit about Mary's life and times. Now THAT is history coming alive!

And btw I agree very much about the humanizing aspect and aware from the "standardized."

I ran across a story on the genealogy forum about an ancestor, full of typos. So what.

It read:

"Abijah Ross has trained himself up some bear hunting dogs. Well, them dogs treed a bear one day, so Abijah told his son to go fetch up his musket. It took four bullets to put that bear down. Abijah swore the bear was 600 pounds."

Any profile that "locks out" that kind of story has not much interest to me.

Dear Erica,

I also knew, working by my own consulting historical books and www.familysearch.org, etc. about my eldest ancestors: Gea and Uranus and have closed three or four branches. I don't descend from Salem Witches but I do from Druids that explains some kind of premonition feelings I have and several King Templars whose sense of justice and social welfare I inherited. Not only me, but many others members of my family who prefered to volunteer than being the richest one of the cementery.Perhaps it takes more time but as italians say: piano, piano, on va lontano..

Regards,

Sylvia.