Bertrade "l'Ancienne" de Prüm - two sets of parents

Started by Sharon Doubell on Thursday, November 8, 2012
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Merging in a duplicate tree has given Bertrade two sets of parents. As her parentage is open to debate, it seems better to discuss which parents we will settle on giving her. Justin Durand, Private User, Jason Scott Wills are the most recent curator revisions here.

Pretty much what is in the Summary in the About section sums up my opinion. Her parentage and spouse are not positively determined.

Still leaving the problem of what to do about her 2 sets on Geni :-)

My preference is always to follow Settipani, where he has ventured an opinion. We've done that in other areas of the tree, and some curators have suggested that it is our Geni convention to do that. I wouldn't go that far, but being consistent would help us avoid the problem of making conflicting decisions in different parts of the tree.

I'm good to go with that Justin Durand - it makes a lot of sense. I think Private User is likely to agree.

This is still an outstanding Tree Conflict. Do you guys want me to resolve it?

"My son, Rodrigo Castel, shared these genealogical informations. He doesn't use Geni anymore. He uses MyHeritage now. So, any wrong information here, perhaps it will be correct in his pedigree chart in MyHeritage. Regards, Victor Castel."

Sharon Doubell There is a double of Bertrada of Prüm assigned as daughter of Theodoric, this is the double:
Bertrade de Prüm

And referring to my last comment, there is a long long source explanation about the familiar relationships around Bertrada de Prüm in the about section of this profile:
Saint Doda of Neustria

Maybe time to either merge the two Bertrada's or delete one, because there certainly can't be many atthe same time.
What do you think Sharon Doubell ?

Thanks, I've merged them in.

What primary sources have been found to validate her parents, Maria?

I can find the Settipani onomastics argument.

Also here on Theodoric III, king of the Franks
3. [BERTRADA [Berta]. Abbess of Prüm. Settipani suggests that Bertrada, abbess of Prüm and great grandmother of Charlemagne, was the daughter of King Theoderich III, basing this on the transmission of the names Charibert and Theoderich into the Carolingian family[503]. m ---.]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bertrada_of_Pr%C3%BCm

Bertrada came from a wealthy Austrasian noble family. Several alternative solutions to the question of her parentage have been suggested, among them:

  • She was daughter of the seneschal and Pfalzgraf Hugobert and Irmina of Oeren
  • She was the daughter-in-law of Irmina (died c. 704), daughter of Hugobert and Irmina, and her husband Charveus, Count of Laon, brother of Lambert, Count of Hesbaye
  • She was daughter of Theuderic III, king of Neustria and Austrasia, and Clotilda of Herstal.

The last two possibilities are not mutually exclusive.

Bertrada the Elder was married, but the identity of her husband is unknown.[2] Bertrada and her husband had one known child:

Charibert of Laon[2]

Through Charibert's daughter Bertrada of Laon, wife of Pippin the Short, Bertrada of Prüm is the great-grandmother of Charlemagne.

Hi Sharon!
To be honest I have no idea, I just happened to bump on the profiles because Erica was looking at some weirdness with Berswinda of Austrasia and I was checking out the lineages nearby. That's all that I happened to run into as I had to attend to completely other business outside of this realm. Thanks for attending to the profiles.

Cross reference the discussion https://www.geni.com/discussions/272221?msg=166492 - still a work in progress, comments welcome there.

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