Our connections (to each other and to Budapest)

Started by Gábor Rozsnyai on Friday, July 18, 2014


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7/18/2014 at 10:29 PM

Hallo @Roy C Grant, nice to see you here.

You are my first cousin twice removed's wife's sister's husband's brother's wife's second cousin once removed's wife's brother's wife's first cousin thrice removed's husband.

What information you have "about Budapest Czettels, Posners, Frankls, Goldschlagers, Mangolds, Rath-Veghs, Hertzkas, Hertzogs, Szollossis, Sterns, Guttmanns, and several others that fail to instantly come to mind ."

I am living in Budapet and I am connected many of the profiles in this project.

let's have a chat about us, our relatives and about this city

Private User
7/19/2014 at 12:47 AM

Hi Gabor,
I live in Budapest too, but am not Jewish and don't speak much Hungarian.
My info falls into several distinct areas.
Closest Jewish relatives which are my prime focus were the printing families of Czettel (formerly out of Nagy Abony) and Posner (4 Jewish children from Obuda adopted by the wife of a merchant c 1812-1822)
Spin offs from them were the Hertzkas, Hertzogs, Aschners (Tungsram) Mangolds and Goldschlaegers.
The Posner - Czettel line unites in with Transylvanian Guttmanns, Sterns, Brulls and Jakabs who also made it to BP.

Amongst the many interesting document I possess are all the affidavits and certificates that the family misguidedly provided the authorities with in 1939, thereby ensuring my wife's father was dispatched to a camp. We still have the star that he had to sew onto his clothing even though he left the faith in 1919.

The two most interesting characters in my line are:
[1] Ladislav Czettel (costume designer for films and European Opera houses)
[2] Adel Diosy nee Brull (famed mistress of Hungarian poet, Ady Endre)

Regards Roy

10/6/2014 at 11:20 AM

Hallo Roy and other readers,

I am very glad to have conversation with you.

It is our possibility to give names in some structure to represent intersting and significant part of our history and that of our city
The familiesand names which youmentioned could be listed in this project as profiles, documents, descriptions, discussions, etc.
It would be interesting to meet ifyou arein Budapest andalsywith other "cousins" who has has the same interest.



Private User
10/19/2014 at 2:05 AM

Hi Gabor
You never replied to my message telling you I would be in Budapest all this week. I now have to return to the Village. Perhaps we can get together some other time. Roy

10/19/2014 at 9:34 AM

sorry Roy,
Private User

I don't know which message - maybe I have not seen. Sure we meet some other time. Today I started to collect Middle Europeaan (living here and having relatives here around Budapest - 500 km circle) and I hope we can organise some meetings. The interesting one
is the "Middle Eurpean Branch Party as a satellite event of the GFR "
Iinvited you to the project and see the discussion.

I !d like to add an important note : we are here in a discussion for "Jewish Families" from Budapest, Hungary but we are all connected and this is not dependent on religion or natioanlity or race.

So I want tocollect alsohere the Geniusers living here "nearby".

Ihope your help

sorry again that Imissed you..

let's continue..



Private User
10/19/2014 at 9:49 AM

Hi Gabor
It seems I may have wrongly accused you of not replying, for although I am positive that I sent the message, there is no copy in my sent file. So although I expected you to get in touch during the week, you were unaware that my plans had changed and I was spending the week in the city after all.

Re the Middle Europe Geni Gathering.
I think I explained before that I am not really a group person, and have a preference for solitude. So although I wish you well, I think I must politely decline your invitation to join everyone.

Regards Roy

11/28/2014 at 6:26 PM

Our Budapest relations have many interestings aspects written in various books. It would be nice to collect them
I just read the book
I Kiss Your Hands Many Times:..by .Marianne Szegedy-Maszak
but there are many others, and many Budapest event,names, connections could be mentioned in the project
Kornfeld-Weiss (Manfred Weiss de Csepel, Baron), Chorin, Zwack, Mauthner, Goldberger, etc
other books e.g.
Reflections of Twentieth Century Hungary: A Hungarian Magnate's View
by Moric Kornfeld, Agnes Szechenyi (Editor), Thomas J. DeKornfeld (Translator)
Baron Moric Kornfeld (1882-1967) was a prominent Hungarian industrialist, large-estate owner, and philanthropist. He was also an intellectual and active participant in public affairs. He served in the Upper House of parliament and during the 1920s, was an influential supporter of Prime Minister Count Istvan Bethlen's "reformconservative" policies.
He was instrumental in the establishment of the conservative highbrow periodical Magyar Szemle, to which he contributed. .....

Private User
11/29/2014 at 5:54 PM

Marianne's book is a great read and very informative for anyone interested in another aspect of the Hungarian Holocaust experience. Many of my relatives, like Marianne's, considered themselves to be Hungarians who happened to be Jewish. Unfortunately, the Nazis and their collaborators in the Arrow Cross ignored that distinction.

Private User
11/29/2014 at 5:58 PM

Marianne's book is a great read and very informative for anyone interested in another aspect of the Hungarian Holocaust experience. Many of my relatives, like Marianne's, considered themselves to be Hungarians who happened to be Jewish. Unfortunately, the Nazis and their collaborators in the Arrow Cross ignored that distinction.
Coincidentally, Gabor is connected to my great-grandmother Ottilie POLACSEK NEUMANN as my third great aunt's brother's wife's sister's husband's brother's wife's uncle's wife's second great nephew.

Private User
12/2/2014 at 4:04 AM

The subject has swung onto books, so I thought I would also throw in 'Letters in the Archives, that are also well worth reading. One set that fascinated me are now held in Yale university USA, amongst the papers deposited Margit S Mahler, an eminent Jewish child psychologist. who was educated in Budapest.

Following the end of WW2, her former university friend Gizella (Gizi) Czettel came out of hiding and wrote to her, sometimes several times a week about life in post war Hungary under the Russians. She pleaded for food, clothing and medicines or dollars to buy them on the black market. Margit kept all those letters and it now provides an excellent record to show that even though the war was over, there were still horendouis difficulties in obtaining any of the above as well as finding or reclaiming acommodation and loss of personal freedoms.

12/4/2014 at 3:58 PM

Thank you Roy I didn' t find exactly what you meant.

It was an hour ago. Inbetween I found it. (https://aeonrouting.library.yale.edu/Default.aspx?service=https%3a%...)
But the question is still here> how can it be transparent and easy overviewable. Partly my thoughts are still about representation.
1) We should represent persons (and facts) ordered to various aspects. Here for instance "Budapest School of Psychoanalysis"
2) connection of families here Czettel and Mahler (and Posner, etc) families
3) links :
3.1)have you a link about htese letters? Or which accesI can have to "Gizella's post WW2 letters are in the Margaret S. Mahler collection held in Yale University, USA, and document wartime and post war hardships in Hungary under both German and Russian occupation"
3.2 http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~prohel/names/misc... (in it Arpad CZETTEL Died: May 28, 1939 + Gizella BÄCHER Died: 1950s)
again how to represent?
4) references to books - how is this to be represented ? maybe in this discussion or more systematic?
5) an important factor is the schools in Budapest (here the Vaci street Gymnasium, where I thin Gzella and Margit were together, but many other...) Woud you find place all for these in the project (on the page)?

Private User
12/4/2014 at 9:06 PM

Gabor, I think your mention of books a few messages back (I Kiss Your Hands Many Times:..by .Marianne Szegedy-Maszak) and mine of letters should have been a new subject for it is in no way connected to our previous discussions in this string.

As for other matters. There was no FAMILY connection between Mahler and Czettel, these were just two college friends who wrote to each other.

12/5/2014 at 12:38 AM

yes Roy, I agree
under connection I didn't mean realtives relation. As I understood they went to the same scool. And that's an important relation in my oöpinion. The schooling was quite well solved I think and a main factor also at that time.

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