Moytoy I

Started by Tina Paulene Weir on Thursday, April 13, 2017
Showing 1-30 of 46 posts
4/13/2017 at 5:32 PM

I was just wondering where and how factual documentation has been attained other than the internet, when it comes to Thomas Pasmere Carpenter, when apparently he is a fictional person. It is hard enough to document Indian lineage, and then have half truths or no truths out there about persons, makes it even harder. There apparently is no documentation of a person named Thomas Pasmere Carpenter. There is documentation of a Thomas Pasmore, a carpenter (his occupation). No documentation of Thomas Pasmere Carpenter ever coming to America or of his "internet parents" being his parents. And Running Water, Tennessee wasn't even established until several years after he supposedly died there. ??? I would truly appreciate some real leads on the parents of Nancy (Pathkiller) Moore and her parents. Was Nunna'dihi' Pathkiller really her father? Where is the real and un-disputable evidence. Is it even possible to actually trace this line of Cherokee? And not just to say "hey I am Cherokee" but to truly know who I am, I need beyond a shadow of a doubt. I have proven that Nancy (Pathkiller) Moore's daughter, if she is her daughter, Rachel Tabitha (Moore) McGuire is my 3rd great grandmother but beyond that there is no "paper trail", no name on the Dawes Roll (that I have found) that matches this family line. So how is it that so many have found so much to "prove" their lineage to this family and I have found not much? It bothers me that so many are just copying what others have posted. I am desperately seeking TRUTH and REALITY. If anyone can help, I welcome it. If anyone has access to a death record of any kind on Rachel Tabitha McGuire, I would appreciate if you could share. Thanks

4/14/2017 at 10:44 AM

Hi Tina

I'm tagging some of the profiles you mention to this discussion so we can click on the profile and see the tree.

Moytoy, of Tellico

Trader Thomas Pasmere "Cornplanter" Carpenter, (Fictional)

Nancy "Polly" Ann Moore (Pathkiller)

4/14/2017 at 5:16 PM

I sent a message to all on what I had been doing as far as research please check your messages

4/15/2017 at 12:24 PM

Look for the ships manifest. I found a Thomas Passmere on one of them, But could not find a Thomas Passmere Carpenter.
Thomas from what I understand came from England at an age the colony thought him to young to purchase land. He is referred as Amadya Moytoy, His son is Amatoya Moytoy, and his son was referred to as Trader Tom.
I've spent the last 10 plus looking at this line. Old hop/Kanagatuckco is my grandfather

4/15/2017 at 2:40 PM

I am anxious to see what the gal at the Smithsonian comes up with. I never discount others research right away. I like to look at it compile it and then try to come to a good conclusion. Happy hunting!

4/15/2017 at 4:52 PM interesting page from virginia land grants of 1600's

4/15/2017 at 5:38 PM

I have seen the Virginia Land grants page but there seems to some discrepancy as to whether Carpenter is his last name or , a carpenter is his occupation. It also states that he abandoned the land, the transfer took place because he gave it up to this Robert Marshall; not because it was taken away from him because of his age.
Robin Emery: There was a Thomas PASMORE on a ship and he was a carpenter by trade/occupation. But his last name was not Carpenter, and so that kind of throws a kink in the chain between him and Robert Carpenter being his father. Pamela Suhre: if you look more closely at the name on your own link above, it actually says Pasmore. Other acceptable spellings of this name at the time were Pasemore, Pasmour, and Pasmoure, Passmore, The land office document is also a lease, not an abondonment, and then rather than his trade beginning with lower case "c" it begins with a capital "C". Because of the lack of punctuation back then his name and trade are just run together, which make me wonder why his name wasn't read as Thomas Pasmore Carpenter Southerly.. There are no commas, no deliberate attempts to separate his name and trade. There is no hard, documented proof that Thomas Pasmere Carpenter existed, so he could not possibly be Moytoy I, or the father of Maoytoy II, etc, etc... PAMELA SUHRE please let us know what you find out from the Smithsonian, it will surely be interesting. Has anyone tried researching Thomas Pasmore and found anything connecting him to the Shawnee or Cherokee?

4/15/2017 at 8:13 PM

I have no special agenda I am only doing research as you are and everyone else who is on or contributes to I found the document interesting. Also I am not trying to prove anyone right or wrong. That's why we call it research I promised I would let everyone know anything I found out. When I read the land grant I found it interesting

4/15/2017 at 8:42 PM also interesting name spelling and variations

4/15/2017 at 8:50 PM I also found this article interesting especially the part about bynames

4/15/2017 at 9:09 PM this was one I found a long time ago I have not verifed all of the data, however I have done some research on the ships

4/15/2017 at 9:55 PM there is alot of information here I have not researched it yet maybe some of it may help

4/16/2017 at 12:59 AM

pamela suhre-HiI am a seventh cousin removed -(cant remember how many times ) to Amatoy Moytoy. The part I know is that my Grandmother Huddleston came to america, landed in Pa.(Huddleston house is still there. ) Her family moved to the south going down the Great riverway.there were all kinds of dukes, Lords.etc in the line I'm from Anyway in researching I found Thomas carpenter Pasmere,(the spelling I found) was connected to amatoy,and then on down. Apparently some of the huddleston were in Tn.,W Va. were Eastern Cherokee. My problem is that some person keeps changing things about the family ,not related as far as I can tell,so I go by what I found. there is no one left to ask or write to and I am 77 years old, so ... I had corresponded with a person, Don Cordell,he some information for me ,but then he changed his e mail address
but he told me he was writing a book about the Huddleston history.Do you think you could find this person? I am not real savvy about using computers,but I know there are ways to connect. Keep in touch, Lila Lindberg Minnesota

4/16/2017 at 8:54 AM

I will send you all that I can find I know if we all work together we can come up with the truth. I am 66 years old. I am a shut-in but have a wonderful family and a large group of friends who love me. So here goes I will be sending you links I hope you and I can find what you are looking for.

4/16/2017 at 9:02 AM

This next one includes an email address for Don

4/16/2017 at 9:19 AM

I found something interesting on the southerly part may be referring to a direction here's the link

4/16/2017 at 12:06 PM

Tina I think I found something on your grandmother look at this link

4/16/2017 at 4:27 PM

Thank you, Pamela I already have that information on my grandmother, but what I need and is probably going to be impossible to get is a hard copy of a death record. I have some emails into local churches in the area where she died and just found the name of a funeral home from back in the day in that area. And my point about the "southerly" in the land document was, that since it was also capitalized, I'm surprised it didn't end up as part of his name. I know that it is a direction. Sorry didn't mean to be confusing about that.

4/16/2017 at 11:53 PM

Here are some links to the Pasmere name Here are some links for Carpenter

4/17/2017 at 12:12 AM

These two links for Pasmere and Carpenter indicate that Thomas Pasmere (seafarer) Carpenter (builder) was a builder of ships

4/17/2017 at 12:18 AM

This is a link to the Cherokee Heritage Documentation Center page 55 good link

4/17/2017 at 12:51 AM

These next links Asa Skelton family Bible and a Diary kept by Trader Tom Carpenter I hope these next two links can help us find some answers. Notice too that it quotes from Shawnee heritage page 229 and I am also researching a site that has written eyewitness accounts and a site that contains correspondence from England to Jamestown Hope this helps

4/17/2017 at 1:13 PM

Pamela thanks, I will check these out.

4/17/2017 at 2:38 PM

My gal at the Smithsonian got back to me this morning she says that while they a lot of research they do not focus on genealogy because it is too personal and advised me to get in contact with others who are researching their genealogy. So back where we began.

4/17/2017 at 10:31 PM

Yet another clue

4/18/2017 at 4:06 PM

Pamela, when reading this one must pay attention the the statement that it only based on data collecting and not all of it has been documented as true. So unless they have "proof", it's just another dead end. I tried to click on some of the links there, but got the message the page did not exist. Tried to email the person but not a valid email. Curious-er and curious-er. :) That's too bad about the Smithsonian.

4/18/2017 at 5:03 PM

I also tried some of the links and found the same thing. However sometimes that happens as far as her email goes I sent a message to her and didn't get an error message but there were several email links at the bottom of the page maybe you tried one I did not. I have not heard back from her though so maybe it did not go through.

4/19/2017 at 11:23 AM

I did get to the email but no response yet and they may not even update this site anymore, anyway it is worth looking through and seeing if there is anything worth researching.

Showing 1-30 of 46 posts

Create a free account or login to participate in this discussion