Maijken Hendricksdr van den Oever - timeline discrepancies

12 March 1651
Birth of Maria Schepmoes (Krom)
Meppel, Drenthe, Netherlands

While there is still a very common meme that Maijken was from Meppel I think that we have debunked that theory. It therefore seems highly unlikely that her daughter, Maria, was born in Meppel.

I have checked Drenthe archives for baptisms in 1651 and there are no matches, it is possible that the records are incomplete this far back.

I think we should change the location of this event to Opijnen, Gelderland, Netherlands to match the other Crom children's stated birth locations.

1652
Birth of Joost Van Meteren
Meteren, Geldermalsen, Gelderland, Netherlands

Joost is currently born 7 years before his parents marry. He is also born before several of his older step-siblings.

Either Joost's DOB is too early or Crom children and death of Willem Crom need to be shifted backwards.

I haven't looked at this too closely lately but my initial inclination is to adjust Joost's DOB upwards to post date marriage of his parents, simplest solution.

I'm feeling c.1660 which makes him the 2.5 year old on the ships manifest.

1653; Birth of Gijsbert Van Meteran (Crom)
1660; Birth of Gysbert Janse Van Meeteren

Are these supposed to be the same person? Opinions vary as to which of Maijken's husbands was Gijsbert's father so we currently seem to be hedging our bets :)
I haven't seen any suggestion elsewhere that there were two Gijsberts but it is possible.

Gijsbert vM (Crom) went on to get married several times and have a big family, Gijsbert Jans vM doesn't seem to have done anything. This to me indicates that there was only one Gijsbert, the elder Crom version.

I can find 6 NA baptisms for Gijsbert [sp] in which he is always either Krom or Crom, no sign of using the name vM (his step?-brother Joost Jansz is a sponsor at the first ... could be his gfather but not sure he ever emigrated to NA).

I am inclined to merge the younger Gijsbert into the older, clarify the name fields to remove doubt that he is a Krom and add vM into his AKA.

Willem Gijsbertsz Krom
Jan Joosten van Meteren
Gijsbert Willems Krom
Gysbert Janse Van Meter
Maria Willems Schepmoes
Joost Jansen Van Meteren, of Meppelen

Only a year after arriving in America, little Joost Jansen Van Meteren had an adventure ... captured by Indians. On June 7, 1663, ... Little Joost, too young to be much affected by the horrors of captivity, thoroughly enjoyed his three months of Indian life.

Not sure of the source but definitely suggestive that JJ Jnr was one of the youngest children on the ships manifest in 1662, so either 3.5 or 7 when captured.

FROM A genealogy of the Duke-Shepherd-Van Metre family, from civil, military, church and family records and documents
by Smyth, Samuel Gordon, b. 1859 p.14

In the testamentary disposition written by Jan Joosten Van Meteren under date of i6th December, 1681, appears the following:

"Wife Macyke shall retain full possession (of the estate). She con-
sents that the survivor shall possess everything: lands, houses, personal
property, money, gold, silver — coined or uncoined. After their decease,
the property to be inherited by their children. Jooste to have one-half of
the entire estate first. Jooste and Gysbert to have the land at Marble-
town, Jooste one half and then the other half to be divided between them.
Geertje Crom to have the land at Wassemaker's land. Children of
Lysbeth, deceased, to have their portion, in money, from the other
children
[See Ulster Co., N. Y., Probate Records.]

It would thus appear than Jooste Jans was the eldest son, and
it is believed that the daughters were older than the sons.

I don't think i agree with Smyth. Joost being named first could just as easily be evidence that Joost was heir as the only vM and that Gysbert was a stepson.

I think that without any documentary evidence specifically showing that there were two Gysberts that the confusion him is just that, confusion. The confusion could be caused by two sons but i think it is just lack of documents causing the confusion.

As I posted earlier I think Joost's time in captivity without ill treatment is a strong indicator that he was the youngest child on the ships manifest, ie born c.1660 which puts me in what Ehrlich calls the "Crom standpoint" :

● c.1647: Hendrick Willems Crom
● c.1650: Lysbet Willems(e) Crom
● c.1653: Gysbert Willems Crom
● c.1656: Geertje [Willems] Crom
● c.1660: Joost Jansen Van Meteren

http://www.skeeterkitefly.com/finelineage_V4.htm

I agree that joost "the captive" must have been the youngest. And if he was too little, he wouldn't have survived.

I'll leave it for a week to see if anyone disagrees and cares to comment before i smerge into the "Crom standpoint".

On a slightly different note.

I think Gysbert Hendrickse needs cutting and deleting. His presence is based on one sentence (and i use the term loosely) on this web page http://www.genealogy.com/forum/surnames/topics/crum/1819/

Regarding Maycken Hendricks Van Der Oever it says "brother to Gysbert Hendricks". Given that Maycken is a woman and so cannot be anyone's brother it casts a certain level of doubt as to where this fragment of a sentence came from. The most logical explanation might be if Gysbert Hendricks stood at Maycken's wedding in place of their father? I don't recall ever seeing a transcript of the marriage.

Also I couldn't resist editing the patronym from Hendricksdr to Hendricks, the later being a truncation as opposed to an abbreviation.
Hendricksdotter might be more accurate, but might also be invention.
Just a personal bug bear :)

I see the "dotter" sometimes in New Amsterdam but not often. Is it Dutch?

Yes. Jans can be a truncation for Janszoon or Jansdotter depending on gender, it also makes the tree look neater as all siblings have the same "last name".

In reality someone might use Jans, Jansz, Janss, Janson, Janssoon, Janszoon, Jansen, Janssen interchangeably throughout their life cos of sloppy spelling. Then what they verbalised...?

I've seen women in records with Jansz which isn't correct anatomically but without a time machine who really knows, not me.

I have never come across dotter for daughter in the Dutch tree. I checked the word with google translate and it shows up as the Swedish word for daughter. It is definitely not a Dutch word. To make absolutely sure I typed it with the dutch dictionary : http://www.vandale.nl/opzoeken?pattern=dotter&lang=nn

Dochter is most often abbreviated as dr = Jansdr, Willemsdr. etc.

Jans, Jansz, Janss, Janson, Janssoon, Janszoon, Jansen, Janssen.
A persons name will be often spelled differently in different records. In the above example Jansz, Jans and Janszoon are the most familiar to me. I can't remember coming across Janss, Janson, Jansoon, Jansen and Janssen in the Netherlands, Are these ways of spelling 'the son of Jan' after New Amterdam and later? They look so strange to me.

You right Ann i got my European ancestry mixed up, i should have checked the dictionary first, dochter not dotter.

I think the strange spellings of Jans are reflections of poor literacy and numerous cultures in the same environment.