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Query on parents of Roza EPSTEIN

Started by Private User on Thursday, November 17, 2022
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What is the source for Martin Epstein being the father of Róza / Rosalia Rosenthál and Bertha Epstein

Here is Rosa's death record which appears to have different parents listed for her. Can someone translate the Hungarian for me

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GGB9-9JKR?i=69

Private User can you help?

I cant help P J D, but am able to explain the problem in a little more detail

The information is on the left hand page of this registration of death for Roza Rosenthal nee Epstein
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GGB9-9JKR?i=69

It states that the parents of the late Roza nee Epstein, former wife of Ignacz Rosenthal were the late Lajos Epstein and his late wife Terez Steiner both of Bekescsaba.
The present Geni tree however, does not agree and shows her father as Martin and no mother.
Although that could simply be adjusted to conform with the official record, for reasons shown later, I am reluctant to do so.

The Geni tree does actually list a Terez Steiner, but she is not shown as Roza's mother, but appears as her mother in law married to her father in law Márton Rosenthal.
I have yet to find any evidence of Terez having Marton Rosenthal as a husband and I therefore wonder if Mr D has listed Roza's mother as the partner of her father in law quite by accident?
Again that error could also be adjusted, but no action has been taken because of an even further domino effect

The Geni tree at present, also shows Terez Steiner as the mother of Marton Rosenthal's children (Gyula / Julius Rostás, Mina Rosenthal. and Roza's husband Ignacz). Unfortunately no link to any record has been submitted to confirm that to be the case, so I am seeking some sort of official record to confirm who were the parents of those children?

I certainly realize that this particular area of the Rosenthal tree needs adjustment, but I am unwilling to tackle the task myself, for some profiles in the immediate vicinity are locked, so I presume that the information they contain is sensitive and as such, cannot be subject to alteration.

That is why I initially asked for Leanne's assistance and she has correspondingly put the matter up for discussion.

Can anyone help?

Regards Roy

On Geni Róza / Rosalia Rosenthál husband is Ignacz Rosenthál the son of Márton Rosenthal and Caecilia Rosenthal

There are tree conflicts on his siblings

They have 2 mothers Caecilia Rosenthal and Caecilia Rosenthal

Does anyone have any sources for these so we can detach them from the wrong parents?

I think we may be getting somewhere.
A Lajos Epstien who was married to aTerez Steiner, appears on Jewishgen as Ludwig.

EPSTEIN, Ludwig / Eliezer married STEINER, Theresia / Reizel
parents Leopold / Yehuda Leib / ha'levi / Rosalia (SCHARFER)
and Herrmann / Tzvi HIrsh / Barbara () ages 23 and 18 25-Dec-1853 Arad
Groom farmer, from/born in Arad, mother deceased.
Bride from/born in Arad, parents deceased.
Witnesses Leopold EPSTEIN and Max HERZ.
Romanian Nat'l Archives -Arad, Reg.1018-30

Two children also listed on Jewishgen are Rozalia 1855 and Bertha 1856

Another significant step forward
https://dspace.oszk.hu/handle/20.500.12346/470754#

The above death notice shows Terez Steiner married to her daughter Roza's Father in Law Marton. Clashing birth years indicate any Rosenthal children on that notice are more than likely from Marton's first wife. The facts are now becoming clearer

SORTED
Roy

Nicely cleared up.
Which marriage came first?
Not that it matters whether Roza and Ignaz became step siblings before or after they married, but it'd be a fascinating story for their descendants.

Went back to add the marriage order P J D, but someone had beaten me to it.
Had I been able to find the dates of those marriages (which someone must know, but I failed to find) solving the riddle would have taken a quarter of the time.

There are still several unresolved issues which other contributors could have easily helped resolve by including links to their sources, but at least the tree is now rid of their duplicates and woolly speculative entries and makes far more sense.
Roy

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