Mayflower Passengers

Started by Private User on Saturday, September 25, 2010

Participants:

  • Private User
    Geni Pro
  • Geni Pro
  • Private User
    Geni Pro
  • Private User
    Geni Pro
  • Private User
    Geni member

Profiles Mentioned:

Related Projects:

Showing 541-570 of 842 posts
Private User
11/9/2010 at 8:18 AM

Daniel Dupree Walton

I am in the same boat......
I have been toying with the removed thing.....and think I have it...
and then it scrambles.

It show how far from the main person that you are......but how
you figure it out, I have not conquered.

I am glad that Geni does the mathematics.

Ethel

11/9/2010 at 8:27 AM

Your parents and children are once removed from you. Your grandparents and grandchildren are twice removed from you. "Removed" is just the generational separation from you. 12th cousin means you share the same 11th great-grandparent, and twice removed means generationally, one is like the grandparent of the other.

Hope this helps.

Dave.

Private User
11/9/2010 at 8:51 AM

I like to think of "once removed" "twice removed" as being carted off somewhere, but then again, Generation X people have always had issues with their surrounding generations... :)

Private User
11/9/2010 at 11:41 AM

The level cousin you are reflects how closely related you are to someone.

12th cousin means you share an 11th great grandparent, like David said. that means that one of my 8192 11th great grandparents and one of Anita's 8192 great grandparents were the same person. We are both at the same generation. Think of the tree - we're on the same line. My children are also 12th cousins with Anita, but one further generation on one side, so 12th cousins, once removed. Their kids (give it 20 years or so) will be 12th cousins, twice removed with Anita. If Anita has a kid, I'd be 12th / once removed from them and my kids and her kids would be 13th cousins.

11/9/2010 at 12:16 PM

The "removed" thingy is also a great way to find relationship problems in the tree. You should never be more than 2-3 times removed from anyone else using Geni right now. If you are, chances are there is a generational rift somewhere in the tree between you and the other person. It's a great way to check and fix problem areas.

11/9/2010 at 12:44 PM

I have to disagree, David.. people can have kids in their teens, all the way through their 40s or even 50s and 60s (particularly men). It wouldn't be impossible for someone the same age as me to be a 3rd cousin 3 times removed -- let alone anyone on Geni, where I've found 30th cousins!

Private User
11/9/2010 at 12:45 PM

That's incorrect, unless you're talking about looking at someone that is roughly your age, but even then, it's not necessarily true.

If you look at someone who lived a while ago, you will be many generations removed. I'll pick on Anita some more. We share an 11th great grandparent. Anita's 9th great grandparent is my 9th great grandparent's 1st cousin. Her 9th great grandparent is my 1st cousin, 11 times removed. Her 8th great grandparent is my 2nd cousin, 10 times removed. 3/9, 4/8, 5/7, 6/6, 7/5, 8/4, 9/3, 10/2, 11/1 and finally, Anita is my 12th cousin (0 removed).

After all this, I remembered that Anita and I are 12th cousins, twice removed, not just 12th cousins. I'm not redoing the math though. Pretend we're 12th cousins. :)

Private User
11/9/2010 at 12:49 PM

We posted at the same time. My disagreement is in David's statement.

To what Mike said, I am 4 years younger than my Aunt. Her son is my first cousin. I'm 33 years older than him. He's in my generation, not my aunt. One of my fathers first cousins is younger than me. When everyone has 7 kids, the children of the oldest kids and the children of the youngest kids can easily overlap.

Private User
11/9/2010 at 12:50 PM

I don't think that is true....that if you are using Geni..that .you should be only be 2-3 times removed. When you are a cousin but not close.....you have to back along the line to the person you are related to. This person could be really far back....it could be 2 or 3 or more centuries in the past. So you go back to this person in the past...who is your common ancestor of you & the person who you related to....then you go all along the until you get to the present day. That is why you could be 10th or 11th cousin or more.

Private User
11/9/2010 at 1:08 PM

with all this "removed" issue... how can we tell, which person has the older generation, without looking deeper into each others tree?

for example, these are some of my cuzs :)
\
tunku dato iskandar dzulkarnain tunku dato ismail is your 17th cousin 6 times removed.Private User

Mohamed Kamal Bin Hussain is your 19th cousin four times removed.
Private User

Betule Sairafi is your 30th cousin 9 times removed.
Betule Sairafi

Robert Brunner is your 36th cousin 6 times removed.
http://www.geni.com/people/Robert-Grant-Br%C3%BCnner/684471#/tab/ov...

11/9/2010 at 1:08 PM

Roberta, I agree with you. As far as nth cousin goes, it could go as far back as the tree is built, 10th, 25th, and so on. I was speaking to the times removed. For example, Brendan Molloy and I are 11th cousins once removed, which means he's actually my father's 11th cousin. It's the number of times removed that shouldn't be more than 2-3 times.

Hope this helps explains my position.

Dave.

Private User
11/9/2010 at 1:12 PM

so it safe to say that if u r in a batch of big families the chances are that you wud be further down in the "removed" generational gap? i know for certain of ths, for example my late grandfather had 18 children with late grandmother who just passed away this year... just imagine if he had more wives....

11/9/2010 at 1:14 PM

احمد, you have to look at the ancestral path that Geni provides. Somewhere in the middle of the path, there will be a brother/sister relationship, meaning that person's parents are the common grandparents. You then need to count the number of ancestors between you and the common grandparents, and between the common grandparents and the other person. The difference in numbers ends up being the number of times removed you are from that person.

Private User
11/9/2010 at 1:15 PM

hey david... it cud also go the other way? you could be brendan's fathers cousin? unless you looked into the trees... i m just asking how can we tell, who is in the "older" generational... wished geni.com can help on this... to some it aint important, but we don have to "respect" those in the older" generation, as this is important in our culture :)

Private User
11/9/2010 at 1:17 PM

yea... exactly, we have to look into the trees... just wished geni.com cud color code all of us and how we r linked, example if your in my older "generation" , the color might be red instead if your in my "Younger" generation, the color is green... i know this may sound trivial hehe:)

11/9/2010 at 1:19 PM

احمد, yes, you are correct. Large families will tend to span what we consider multiple generations, meaning the oldest and the youngest in a large family are age-gapped enough to be parent/child, even though they are siblings. But typically, this could be happening on both sides of the tree between you and who you are determining relationship with, so I will stick with my 2-3 times removed max to any other GENI user (which are typically between the ages of 20-70).

Dave.

11/9/2010 at 1:23 PM

احمد, you can look at the other person's profile page, and click on the blue button at the top that says "How are you related?" GENI will draw the complete path for you. Look for the 'brother/sister' relationship in the path, and count ancestors on both sides. In my case with Brendan, he's 11th cousin with my father, because there is an equal number of ancestors between the common grandparent and them, which makes me 11th cousin once removed to Brendan

Private User
11/9/2010 at 1:24 PM

but david look at my earlier posts please as some of the people i have listed before are still alive and kicking here in geni.com (unless they bother fake themselves like "claimed historical profiles), hence, ur above statement is a very important part of my research as it now puts te truth of my tree in much of spotlight, no offence i hope... just for the sake of research :)

Private User
11/9/2010 at 1:26 PM

also david, if your "pro" user then you cud... but i m a stinger bugger, so geni.com punishes me by not letting me know that easily hehe :)

Private User
11/9/2010 at 1:31 PM

here's few other profiles which related to me, which means there's something very wrong with my tree, as i had a few dinners with one of them recently...

Wan Ahmad Tajuddin Wan Abdullah is your 19th cousin 11 times removed.
Private User

Tengku Farizatul Ikhsan is your 18th cousin five times removed.
Tengku Farizatul Ikhsan

Private User
11/9/2010 at 1:44 PM

Dave, what you're saying is a good guideline for other living people. If you and I were n cousins, 6 times removed, you're right, that would be a reason to look into the tree to see if something is wrong.

احمد, unless they are a few hundred years old, there is a problem. :)

Private User
11/9/2010 at 2:14 PM

lol, none of them are that much older than me, not by hundreds of years... but i m serious with david's statement, i would like that be part of the research of my own tree... we can never be more than 2-3 times removed... this is a very important statement made in geni.com... and none of us could prove what is right or wrong... if david's right, i chuck my trees out of the window, but i can only confirm up to my 3rd generations above with other families alive and kicking living in our community, after that, its all based on a "story" book....

Private User
11/9/2010 at 2:17 PM

err.. i m joking about the story book though... hehe

Private User
11/9/2010 at 2:43 PM

Hi Brendan:

Simple math shows that there really is nothing wrong with the statement by احمد that says a pair of 19th cousins 11 times removed can be roughly the same age. Take the case where you have two branches of family, the paternal line consistently has fathers that are roughly age 40 all the way up to the common ancestor, and then the maternal line consistently has mothers who became so at roughly age 20 all the way back down to modern day.

First number is generation (today being 0 on the paternal line side), second number being date of birth, third being date of parentalhood:

Paternal line:

0 - 2010 - 1970
1 - 1930 - 1970
2 - 1890 - 1930
3 - 1850 - 1890
4 - 1810 - 1850
5 - 1770 - 1810
6 - 1690 - 1730
7 - 1650 - 1690
8 - 1610 - 1650
9 - 1570 - 1610

Okay, common parents (40 year old male, 20 year old female) give birth to a brother and sister (could be twins, could be a year or two apart) in 1570. As with her mother before her and on down the line, sister becomes a parent at age 20. Going back to present along the maternal line, where all the women are 20 years old at time of parenthood:

10 - 1570 - 1590
9 - 1590 - 1610
8 - 1610 - 1630
7 - 1630 - 1650
6 - 1650 - 1670
5 - 1670 - 1690
4 - 1690 - 1710
3 - 1710 - 1730
2 - 1730 - 1750
1 - 1750 - 1770
0 - 1770 - 1790

Okay, we right now have a 220 year difference between the paternal generation and the maternal generation. If women keep giving birth to the next mother of the maternal line at age 20, you have exactly 11 generations removed.

Granted this is an idealist example - I doubt you are going to find a family where men consistently became fathers and women consistently became mothers at the same age generation after generation, but if you consider this to be an average for a family, what احمد has described is certainly not impossible.

Private User
11/9/2010 at 2:44 PM

I should proof my work better before submitting :) sorry for the discrepancy between 10 and 9 there on the maternal line. But that shows only that you can have 19th cousins 12 times removed the same age...

Private User
11/9/2010 at 2:48 PM

wow, mr ben angel, thats pretty impressive, i will have to go back and look at this again later in the evening, got to send my kids to school but thanks a lot, good job :)

Private User
11/9/2010 at 2:51 PM

I take that back too, about the 12 times removed... only 11 times removed... forgot that the last generation would have to be age 40 to be the same age.

Private User
11/9/2010 at 2:51 PM

err, i dont claim those as my statements, but just geni.com links to real people with phone numbers and can be contacted easily, some even come to visit me in brunei and we great fun meeting each other and families :)

Private User cant wait for my cuz like him from far a way lands to drop by in future hehe

11/9/2010 at 4:21 PM

I guess I opened a can of worms! Thank you everyone for your thoughts.

I did a Bing search and found this, which seems to confirm almost everyone's statements...and confirms that the number "removed" can be many more than 2-3!

http://www.genealogy.com/16_cousn.html

11/9/2010 at 4:35 PM

I am 16 years older than my youngest sister, and my birth mother is 16 years older than i am. so it is possible!

Showing 541-570 of 842 posts

Create a free account or login to participate in this discussion