Y-DNA Haplogroup - R1b1a2a1a1b4b - R-M269 - R-M222+ - R-DF85 - R-FGC8739
This undifferentiated R1 lineage is quite rare. It is found only at very low frequencies in Europe, Central Asia, and South Asia. This lineage possibly originated in Europe and then migrated east into Asia.
Irish Type I or northwest Irish was identified in a Trinity College study. It is affiliated with Ui Neill. R-M222 is of high interest.
Below from a rootsweb discussion on 8 July 2015
In a new situation that has just emerged, we knew the family descended from the O'Neills (ie +M222). The DNA expert we'd employed (Barry McCain) said they were from Donegal, but since the O'Neills had invaded and settled Ulster from the west through Donegal, this didn't strike me as very interesting. They all came from Donegal. DNA-wise, the most I could find were two clerics bearing a name that could be McCamish (assumed to be son of THomas or James), in Raphoe in the 1400s. The genealogy track takes them to what was Dungannon Barony, various parishes, on the border of Derry and Tyrone. This was the 'heart' of the last O'Neill kingdom. Old castle ruins are still there with two earlier castles to the west. There is an instance of the name found right there in the 1640s that could be an ancestor. Who knows? It was found in the English Parliamentary Papers. These contain a lot of names of people rebelling or killed or fighting for the Crown in Ulster in the 1640s and much earlier. If your ancestor was a spy for Queen Elizabeth among the McDonalds or O'Cahans, etc, etc, in the 1500s you might be able to find them in these papers. One fellow I 'met' did! God bless her, she had spies everywhere. These papers are very good. They are published and indexed. I used copies in the Family History Library in Salt Lake.
Anyway, Barry was able to identify a more recent SNP: R-FGC8739 haplogroup. The date of the formation of the R-FGC8739 haplogroup formation is believed to be circa AD 665. This would not be so exciting anywhere else on the planet because we have little information that early about families. However the Irish have the longest pedigrees in Europe. Since DNA testing often verifies them, in the last 10 years or so the interest in them has increased immensely. Some of these old Gaelic family pedigrees also shed light on Scottish families.
Barry then examined the men who tested as STR matches in the 67 and 111 marker range and then looked to see if anyone with these surnames had SNP tested. There were two:
Mac Congail and Ó Dochartaigh. Since few have SNP tested we are now down to comparing onesies and twosies. When we have hundreds of samples to test of course we may come to different conclusions. However ..... two Doherties did SNP test. They both have the same terminal SNP as my client! Says Barry, this proves that my client's family was descended from the O'Doherties. Furthermore they know the exact place of origin: the small town of Gleneely in the Inis Eogháin peninsula.
The paternal descent of the Ó Dochartaigh family is from a son of Niall of the Nine Hostages named Conall Gulban who died circa AD 465. Barry tells us: " Conall Gulban founded the kingdom of Tír Chonaill (land of Conall), which is called Donegal today.... His nickname ‘Gulban’ comes from the name Benn Ghulbain which is a mountain in County Sligo and an administrative center for Niall of the Nine Hostages at one time. An interesting sidebar, Conall Gulban was the first Gaelic nobleman baptized by the Saint Patrick." How's that for family origins?
The 'surname' O'Doherty was adopted in the 900's. It's really a clan name, not a surname in the sense that the Normans would later use, but why split hairs? Barry says this makes it the earliest surname in Europe. He says "Their territory was in mid Donegal near present day Stranorlar overlooking the Finn River, in Raphoe Barony. In the 1400s Clann Uí Dhochartaigh extended their lands into the Inis Eogháin peninsula." This means my two clergymen in Raphoe in the 1400s were in the right spot.
The other surname in the 67 and 111 STR matches is Mac Congail. Barry says: "The Mac Congail home parishes were in the southern part of Inis Eogháin. In the STR test they are closer to your family than the Ó Dochartaigh matches." This strongly suggests the family descends from these folks in particular.
These folk were hereditary possessors of churchlands, sizeable ones. They lost them at the time of the Plantation. However (I add), since the Protestant church was not required to evict the Irish as tenants, many settled on townlands owned still by the now Protestant church. This is the kind of townland, though southeast of Donegal, where the earliest family members were living in the late 1700s. By that time they were Protestant. Barry even has a possible ancestor who might have been the origin of McThomas (McCamish). Unfortunately none of this family has SNP tested so we do not know if they may share a still unknown 'private marker', but the STR tests suggest that such a marker exists. So we have one confirmed 'private SNP' and the potential for a second! Irish DNA researched has taken a step forward since we can now ID this subgroup of the O'Doherty clan.
So what does all that mean well i am R-FGC8739 and i have some close genetic matches in Donegal from 5 to 10 generations in separation and now i know why.
About My Haplogroup YDNA R1b1a2a1a1b4b R-M222
This subclade within R-L21 is defined by the presence of the marker M222. It is particularly associated with male lines which are Irish or Scottish, but especially northern Irish. In this case, the relatively high frequency of this specific subclade among the population of certain counties in northwestern Ireland may be due to positive social selection, as it is suggested to have been the Y-chromosome haplogroup of the Uí Néill dynastic kindred of ancient Ireland. However it is not restricted to the Uí Néill as it is also associated with the closely related Connachta dynasties, the Uí Briúin and Uí Fiachrach. M222 is also found as a substantial proportion of the population of Scotland which may indicate substantial settlement from northern Ireland or at least links to it. Those areas settled by large numbers of Irish and Scottish emigrants such as North America have a substantial percentage of M222.
For those of you who are wondering why the change from R-M269, i took further DNA tests to refine my results, think of it as defining which sibling i am within the R-M269 family hence i have reduced the number of genetic matches to a more confined group R-M222, and then DF85 and finally R-FGC8739 next step is getting more relatives to have genetic testing at FTDNA - https://www.familytreedna.com Is there more testing of Y-DNA to come, YES we just need to wait for the Scientific world to catch up.
Once our paper trail ends we can only follow the DNA through the Septs or Clans of Ireland and in our case we follow R-M222 back to R-DF85 and then to R-FGC8739 which is as follows -
Cinéal Chonaill (rising in the 5th century A.D.), which is descended from the Uí Néill In Tuaiscirt, which is descended from the Uí Néill, which is descended from the Connachta (rising in the 2nd-3rd century A.D.?), which is descended from the Féni (rising at about the time of Christ?)
Extended DNA testing now defines my DNA Haplogroup as R-FGC8739, for those who care and thought we were Irish as we are here is a surprise for you, further testing to define the exact population groups for my DNA and the "where did i come" from question brought up these results for the last 4000 years.....
The Recent Genealogy by geographical populations-
Following the DNA
- Population (source) Distance
1 Danish 4.76
2 North_Dutch 4.88
3 North_German 5.04
4 Orcadian 5.24
5 Southeast_English 5.31
6 Irish 5.99
7 West_Scottish 6.43
8 Norwegian 6.54
9 Southwest_English 6.73
10 South_Dutch 7.41
11 Swedish 7.6
12 West_German 7.87
13 Austrian 12.47
14 East_German 12.85
15 French 12.89
16 North_Swedish 13.14
17 Hungarian 16.69
18 Spanish_Cataluna 20
19 Southwest_Finnish 20.7
20 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 21.15
The Ancient Genealogy by geographical populations-
- Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 95.9% North_Dutch + 4.1% Bantu_S.E. @ 1.86
2 95.9% North_Dutch + 4.1% Bantu_S.W. @ 1.86
3 96.1% North_Dutch + 3.9% Mandenka @ 1.89
4 95.7% North_Dutch + 4.3% Biaka_Pygmy @ 1.91
5 96.2% Danish + 3.8% Mandenka @ 1.92
6 96.4% Danish + 3.6% Yoruban @ 1.94
7 96.3% North_Dutch + 3.7% Yoruban @ 1.94
8 96.1% Danish + 3.9% Bantu_S.W. @ 1.94
9 96% Danish + 4% Bantu_S.E. @ 1.96
10 95.6% North_Dutch + 4.4% Luhya @ 1.99
11 95.5% North_Dutch + 4.5% Bantu_N.E. @ 1.99
12 95.9% Danish + 4.1% Biaka_Pygmy @ 2.04
13 95.8% Danish + 4.2% Luhya @ 2.14
14 95.7% Danish + 4.3% Bantu_N.E. @ 2.15
15 95.6% North_Dutch + 4.4% Mbuti_Pygmy @ 2.19
16 95.8% Danish + 4.2% Mbuti_Pygmy @ 2.37
17 95.5% North_Dutch + 4.5% San @ 2.48
18 95.8% Danish + 4.2% San @ 2.66
19 95.9% Orcadian + 4.1% Bantu_S.E. @ 2.68
20 96% Orcadian + 4% Bantu_S.W. @ 2.69
I know you are wondering, What is Orcadian, it's a native or inhabitant of the Orkney Islands, Scottish Gaelic. The Orkney Islands,is an archipelago off the north coast of Great Britain, 16 kilometres north of the coast of Caithness. Orkney comprises approximately 70 islands, of which 20 are inhabited.
And those African populations you see there, yes well you have Negro blood flowing through your veins, these tribal groups are from Western Africa.
Bantu is a major branch of the Niger-Congo language family spoken by most populations in Sub-Saharan Africa.
The Mandinka, Malinke (also known as Mandinko or Mandingo) is a West African ethnic group
The Aka or Bayaka (also BiAka, Babenzele) are a nomadic Mbenga pygmy people. They live in southwestern Central African Republic
The Yoruba people (Yoruba: Àwọn ọmọ Yorùbá) are an ethnic group of Southwestern and North central Nigeria
The Luhya (also known as Abaluyia or Luyia) are a Bantu ethnic group in Kenya.
Mbuti a member of a Pygmy people of western Uganda and adjacent areas of the Democratic Republic of Congo (Zaire).
San. well this is the most ancient of Southern African peoples and predates all others... Khoi and San peoples of southern Africa. Are perhaps the oldest populations in Africa, and they have a unique genetic pattern that sets them apart from most other African groups. This likely arose during the long period of time that these populations were genetically isolated from other African groups, perhaps due to climatic forces. Today, the Khoi and San peoples have varying degrees of admixture with Bantu-speaking groups from further north in Africa, and this is reflected in their percentages (52% Southern African and 47% sub-Saharan African). Some San—the famous “Bushmen of the Kalahari”— can be as much as 100% Southern African, however.
So that is the Genetic map of where i came from following Genetic populations over the last 4000 years haha and you lot thought you were Irish.
But there's More - We reach a point back in history were Surnames are not used or perhaps we hit a brick wall because of what they call a non-paternal event (NPE) you can guess what those are, or the paper trail simply disappears, so where do we go from there, well then it becomes Tribal, the Irish much like the Japanese Imperial families have a Tribal Dynasty that can be traced and so we begin to see where we came from and can follow that path geographically as well. This history of Irish Septs written by Jerry Kelly follows our path through Cinéal Chonaill (rising in the 5th century A.D.), which is descended from the Uí Néill In Tuaiscirt which is descended from the Uí Néill, which is descended from the Connachta (rising in the 2nd-3rd century A.D.?), which is descended from the Féni (rising at about the time of Christ?)
Note that this genealogy is tribe by tribe, not generation by generation, so that’s why it’s called a tribal genealogy rather than the generation-by-generation genealogy you’re used to.
Irish Clans-Septs includes O’Donnell History
January 21, 2008 · Filed under Clans, County Donegal, History, Niall of the Nine Hostages, O'Donnell, Septs
Sept is an English word deriving as far as I know from the French word sept for ‘seven’. It’s been used in Ireland to describe kinship groups since the middle ages. I’m guessing the Normans chose the word because it reflected the fact that certain well-known Irish tribes like the Laois were divided into 7 sub-tribes, clans, or dynasties.
- The great 20th century Irish genealogist Edward MacLysaght liked to use the word sept rather than clan when he talked about Irish kinship groups because he didn’t want the word clan to make people think they were dealing with a Scottish clan or a Scottish-style clan. There seems to be a difference between Scottish clan structure and Irish clans and tribes, but I’m no expert on Scottish kinship groups so, in honesty, I don’t know what these differences are. But I do think I’ve noticed that at least some Scottish clan/sept relationships are based on political alliance rather than blood.
For example, are the Hutchinsons as a sept of the McDonnell clan actually descended from the McDonnell clan, a blood branch of it? In the Irish system, a sept or clan always descends in blood from its tribe, even if they wound up with a false genealogy to prove it as sometimes occurred. For example, the Cinéal Chonaill (‘Kinship of Conall’) are actually part of the Uí Néill In Tuaiscirt ! (‘Descendants of Niall in the North’) because they actually descend from Niall.
- With regard to how clans and tribes (or septs if that word is preferred) were formed, it was very much like the Nike commercial – “Just do it!” In the case of my ancestor Conall son of Niall of the Nine Hostages, he and his brothers decided to invade what is now western Ulster. This was mid-5th century A.D. They, like their father, were members of the Connachta who, within the last couple of hundred years had conquered the west of Ireland and placed their own tribe-name on that part of Ireland. So, as part of the invasion plan for western Ulster, Conall and his followers took what is now Tír Chonaill (‘Land of Conall’, aka Co. Donegal).
Conall and his immediate descendants immediately formed the Cinéal Chonaill (‘Kinship of Conall’) to rule their newly-conquered land, electing their own rí or king. Conall’s brother Eoghan and his followers took what is now Tír Eoghain (‘Land of Eoghan’, aka Co. Tyrone in English). Eoghan and his immediate descendants immediately formed the Cinéal Eoghain (‘Kinship of Eoghain’) to rule their new land, electing their own rí or king. As card-carrying members of the Connachta, they continued to owe allegiance to the king of the Connachta, no doubt helping to elect him, but in time their own lineage of the Uí Néill (‘Descendants of Niall’) rivalled and then surpassed that of the Connachta, at which point the Uí Néill ceased to be part of the Connachta politically, although their descent naturally continued to be recognized. And so on clan by clan, tribe by tribe, across Ireland.
- The Irish words used to designate a clan or a tribe are many. At the front of the tribe or clan name you find indicators like Cinéal (‘kinship’), Uí (‘descendants’), Dál (‘share’), Clann (‘children’), Tuath (‘people’), Muintir (‘people’), Síol (‘seed’), Corcu (perhaps ‘seed’ – a word so ancient that nobody is really sure anymore), etc. At the end of an ancestor’s name (especially at the end of an ancestor-god’s name), you can find -raighe (‘people of the god ..X…’), -ne or -ni (‘collective descendants of the god…X..’), or -achta (‘descendants of the god or ancestor-hero …X…), etc.
- Generation-by-generation Irish genealogies are typically accurate back to the late 5th century A.D. unless they’ve been tampered with for political purposes. For example, the genealogies of the Dál gCais are only accurate generation-by-generation as far back as about the 7th century. That’s because they were tampered with to give the Dál gCais a false Eoghanacht genealogy in order to justify the Dál gCais taking the Kinship of Munster. But whether we’re talking about generation-by-generation genealogies going back to the 5th century or to the 7th century, that’s still a lot further back than any other family on the face of the planet except one. Only the Japanese imperial family can match the age and accuracy of the typical Irish person’s genealogy once that Gael has tapped into his/her clan or tribe’s dynastic line.
- But Irish genealogies don’t stop at the 5th century A.D. Although no longer accurate generation-by-generation, they’re still accurate clan by clan or tribe by tribe (unless tampered with for political purposes). For example, the tribal genealogy of the Ó Domhnaill (‘O’Donnell’) dynasty of Donegal is as follows:
Ó Domhnaill (‘O’Donnell’) is descended from the Clann Dálaigh, which is descended from the Cinéal Chonaill (rising in the 5th century A.D.), which is descended from the Uí Néill In Tuaiscirt which is descended from the Uí Néill, which is descended from the Connachta (rising in the 2nd-3rd century A.D.?), which is descended from the Féni (rising at about the time of Christ?)
Note that this genealogy is tribe by tribe, not generation by generation, so that’s why it’s called a tribal genealogy rather than the generation-by-generation genealogy you’re used to.
- By the time you hit the Féni you’re back to around the time of Christ, and that’s one of the short ones. Tribal genealogies of the Laighin families (like the Caomhánach or ‘Kavanagh’ family) appear to go back to the 3rd to 1st centuries B.C. Tribal genealogies of the Érainn families (like the Ó Ceallaigh or ‘Kelly’ family of the Corcu Luighde) seem to go back to the 5th-3rd centuries B.C. Tribal genealogies of the Cruithin families (like the Mag Aonghusa or ‘Guinness’ family) appear to go back to the 8th-5th centuries B.C.
- Sometimes it’s even possible to trace an Irish family back on a tribal basis to before they got to Ireland. But that’s another story.
Hope that’s helpful.
Best Wishes, – Jerry Kelly firstname.lastname@example.org
Following the female line
Haplogroup -mtDNA K1c1b
The mitochondrial super-haplogroup U encompasses haplogroups U1-U7 and haplogroup K. Haplogroup K is found through Europe, and contains multiple closely related lineages indicating a recent population expansion. The origin of haplogroup K dates to approximately 16,000 years ago, and it has been suggested that individuals with this haplogroup took part in the pre-Neolithic expansion following the Last Glacial Maximum.
This MTDNA has been recorded in these countries -
Australia, Canada, Czech Republic, Denmark, England, Finland, France, Germany Greece, Hungary, Ireland, Italy , Lithuania, Netherlands, Northern Ireland, Norway, Poland Galicia, Russian Federation, Scotland, Slovakia, Sweden, Switzerland, United Kingdom United States
Project created January 9, 2006. "Katrine," the founding mother of mitochondrial DNA haplogroup K, was one of the "Seven Daughters of Eve" as listed in the 2001 book of that title by Bryan Sykes. A lot has happened since 2001, but the book is still valuable. Katrine lived about 16,000 years ago. Perhaps the oldest known K descendant was Oetzi the Iceman whose frozen body was discovered in the Alps in 1991. Estimated at 5000 years old, the Iceman proved to have the basic mutations for a K: 16224C and 16311C. Every K is a cousin of Oetzi.
Europe (Western European) Orcadian 90.55% Middle East (North African) Mozabite 9.45%
The Ryan Family is descended from Milesius, King of Spain through the line of Heremon, eighth son of that monarch. The founder of the family was Fiacha Baiceada, son of Cathire More, King of Ireland, A.D.144. The ancient name of the family was Maobreann, signifying "Country Boy". The chiefs of the clan were styled Lords of Idrone and Owney, and their possessions were located in the present County of Carlow and throughout Leinster. This territory of the Ryans was subjected to the intrusion of the Anglo-Normans almost from the landing of the latter in Ireland in 1172.
THE NAME AND FAMILY OF RYAN
The name of RYAN, it is stated by some family historians, is derived from the ancient Irish word righin, meaning "sluggish, or dilatory", and was anciently written Mulrian or O'Mulrian. Others assert that the Irish rian, meaning "Kinglet" or "Prince", was the parent form of the name. The name is found in the early Irish and American records in the various spellings of O'Mulrian, O'Mull Rian, O'Mulryan, Mulrian, Mulryan, O'Righin, Righin, O'Ryan, O'Ryne, O'Rian, O'Roin, Roin, Rian, Ryen, Ryne, Ryan and numerous others. Of those mentioned, the form last mentioned is that most frequently used in America today.
Of Milesian origin, the family traces its descent from one Cormac, the younger son of Nathi or Nathach, King of Leinster about the year 484 A.D. Cormac was Lord or Prince of Idrone, County Carlow, Ireland, about the beginning of the sixth century. This Cormac was the father of Colom or Colman, who was the father of Ronan, father of St. Chronmaol, who had a son named Aodh or Hugh Roin. The last was the father of another Colman, who was father to Laignen, father of Cairbre, father of Hugh, father of Bruadar, father of Dubhghall, father of Righin, from whom the family took its name. Righin was the father of Cairbre, father of Teige, father of Donoch, father of Melachlin, father of Lucas, who had a son named Daithi or David. This David had a son named Neimheach, who was the father of Jeoffrey, father of Henry, who had issue, probably in the latter part of the eleventh century of Henry Mulrian, O'Ryan, or Ryan. A later O'Ryan, Prince of Idrone, was slain by Raymond le Gros in the year 1170.
One branch of this family was represented in the latter part of the fifteenth century by Darby O'Ryan, who was the father of Mahowne, father of Daniel, father of another Darby, father of Daniel, who had a son, William O'Mulryan, who died in 1637. He married Margaret, daughter of John Cantwell, of County Tipperary, about the beginning of the seventeenth century. They were the parents of five sons: Darby, Donoch or Denis, Henry, James, and John, of whom the first, Darby O'Mulryan, resided in County Limerick, Ireland, and married Kathleen Fitzmorice, by whom he left numerous issue.
William Ryan, of Ballymackeogh, County Tipperary, Ireland, was the father about the middle of the seventeenth century of a son named Daniel Ryan, who was the father by his wife Honor, daughter of Colonel John Ewer, of William, Anthony, George, Elizabeth, Anne and Mary. Of these, William married Elizabeth, daughter of Richard Newstead, in 1725 and was the father by her of Ewer, Richard, George, Anne, Elizabeth, William and Anthony, of whom the first was married in 1754 to Elizabeth, daughter of Richard Magrath. To this union was born nine children, William, John, Anthony, Eleanor, Bridget, George, Richard, Rickard and Elizabeth.
John Ryan, son of one Daniel Ryan and his wife Frances, daughter of Patrick Ragget, of Inch House, County Tipperary, was married about 1714 to Mary, daughter of Thomas Mathew, and had issue by her of a son named Daniel, who married Elizabeth, daughter of Justin MacCarthy, in 1737. He was the father by her of, among other children, a son named George Ryan. This George was the father by his wife, Margaret Roche, of six children, Daniel, Philip, George, John, Denis, Margaret, and Elizabeth.
A Tipperary Sept:
The O'Ryans of Owney
The Ryan family of Boggaun was clearly an offshoot of the O'Mulryans of Owney, an important sept whose descendants are today so widely distributed throughout Tipperary and adjoining counties. From time beyond recall the Ryans occupied the tract of land west of a line joining Nenagh and Newport fronting Lough Derg until war and privation forced them far beyond the confines of their ancestral lands. The story of the Ryans of Owney is told in the "Records of Four Tipperary Septs" by M. Callanan, Galway, 1935, and there is no need to repeat here the wealth of detail contained in that book. As we traverse in spirit the wild country once called Owney, we pause for a moment at the ruined Ryan castle of Killoscully before moving southwards over the Keeper Mountains to Foilaclug in the parish of Hollford where, according to local tradition, Eamon an Chnoic or Edmond Knock Ryan, the Rapparee, is buried. Further on to the west, on the Limerick-Tipperary border we enter the now ruined twelfth century cistercian monastery of Abingdon, in a sequestered corner of which a monument to the Ryans bore this inscription:
"The most noble William Ryan, chief of the country of Owney, the head and prince of the ancient family of Ryans caused this monument to be erected to himself, his wife and his children.
"The honour of his posterity and praise of his ancestors caused William Ryan to construct this graceful work.
"Alas, how much nobility proved in peace and war, how much holy faith, virtue and distinguished fame are enclosed in this sepuchral monument of the Ryans. If it should be asked why that which is not destined to die should be shut up, the bones alone are covered in the earth but the other parts that know not death will enjoy perpetual day.
"The praise, virtue, glory and honour of the Ryan race will live forever in this honoured name. A.D. 1632."
from: Handbook on Irish Genealogy
Donal F. Begley
Irish Genealogical Office
Not without distinction in Ireland, where many bearers of the name Ryan were of the landed gentry, the family was represented among the early settlers in America.