John Gresley, Sir
|Birthplace:||Drakelowe, Derbyshire, England, United Kingdom|
|Death:||Died in Gresley,,Derbyshire,England|
Son of Sir Thomas Gresley, Kt., MP and Margaret Gresley
|Managed by:||Private User|
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About John Gresley, Sir
- Sir John Gresley1,2
- M, b. circa 1400, d. 17 January 1449
- Father Sir Thomas Gresley b. bt 1365 - 1367, d. c 1445
- Mother Margaret Walsh d. a 1421
- Sir John Gresley was born circa 1400. He married Elizabeth Clarell, daughter of Thomas Clarell, Esq. and Maud Montgomery, in 1409; They had 2 sons (John & Nicholas) and 2 daughters (Katherine and Thomasine).2 Sir John Gresley married Margaret Norwood, daughter of John Norwood, after 1429. Sir John Gresley died on 17 January 1449.
- Family 1 Elizabeth Clarell b. c 1390
- Katherine Gresley+2 d. a 1449
- Sir John Gresley, Sheriff of Derby & Nottingham+3 b. c 1418, d. 30 Jan 1487
- Family 2 Margaret Norwood b. c 1390, d. a 1 Mar 1449
- 1.[S9214] Unknown author, Pedigrees of Some of Emperor Charlemagne's Descendants, Vol. III, p. 161; Wallop Family, p. 381.
- 2.[S16] Douglas Richardson, Magna Carta Ancestry, 2nd Edition, Vol. I, p. 22.
- 3.[S5] Douglas Richardson, Plantagenet Ancestry, p. 357.
- Sir John Gresley1
- M, #614838
- Last Edited=28 Oct 2012
- Child of Sir John Gresley
- 1.Thomasine Gresley+2
- 1.[S37] BP2003 volume 3, page 4254. See link for full details for this source. Hereinafter cited as. [S37]
- 2.[S37] BP2003. [S37]
- From: http://www.thepeerage.com/p61484.htm#i614838
- Collections for a history of Staffordshire, Volume 1 By Staffordshire Record Society, William Salt Archaeological Society
- Pg. 52
- Sir Thomas de Gresley, Kt.
- (b. abt. 1365: d. abt. 1445.)
- . . . Sir Thomas was probably born about 1365, but first occurs in 1392 when he was already married. In 1394-5 his grandfather Sir John grants him all his manors in Derbyshire, Staffordshire, Leicestershire, Lincolnshire, Northamptonshire and Yorkshire. . . . .
- Pg. 53
- His wife was Margaret daughter of Thomas Walsh of Wanlip in Leicestershire, who occurs as his wife as early as Easter 1392, and was alive in 1421, when she was the recipient of a legacy by her mother Katherine's will. Their issue was:
- 1. John, see p. 54.
- 2. Geoffrey, of whom hardly anything is known: he occurs in 1432/3 and 1439.
- 3. Jane, or Joan, nurse to King Henry vi. She married Thomas de Astley Esq. of Patshull in Staffordshire, who was descended from the last of the Toenis. Henry vi was the only son of Henry v and Katherine of France, and was born at Windsor on Dec. 6, 1421. He succeed as King on Sept. 1, 1422, and probably Joan Gresley was the Royal nurse from his birth until Easter 1424. The fact is known from the Proceedings of the Privy Council, . . .
- I know of no other 'Joane daughter of Sir Thomas Gresley' who could have married John Browne of Morfe, son of Thomas Browne and Alice (nee Banester): their issue was, William, Thomas (who had issue) and John (who married Anne Fitton and had issue).
- Pg. 54.
- 4. Margaret, of whom nothing is known except that she became the first wife of Sir Thomas Blount (d.1456), and the mother of Walter first Lord Mountjoy.
- 5. Another daughter of Sir Thomas seems to be mentioned in the inscription of a monument which till about A.D. 1700 was in Croxall Church. Of this there are tow independent transcripts, one in Bodl. MS. Dodsw. lxxxii, p. 49 (- Reliquary xii. 219) (A), and a second with a drawing of the monument and inscription in St. Loe Kniveton's papers (now Lord Scarsdale's) made about two hundred years ago, and . . . In John Curzon's Will, dated Apr. 1, and proved May 19, 1450, his wife's name is given as Senecha. The marriage is stated by Ussher to have taken place in 1422-3. But Senecha is a very curious name even as a contraction of Innocentia, and rather suggest the Spanish Sanchia which came into the Gresley family at bout this time through the Blounts, see pedigree. To add to the confusion a Derbyshire pedigree based on the Visitations (printed in the Genealogist N.S. vii. 73), give her name as Anne ! The Spanish name is not unknown in English history, King John's wife having been Sanchia of Provence, while it is found in the Carew family.
- Pg. 54
- Sir John Gresley, Kt.
- (occ. 1410: d.1449.)
- Sir John only survived his father for about five years, and so we naturally do not find much recorded of him. He probably married in 1409 or 1410, or in II Hen. 4 some trustees grant to him and 'Elizabeth Clarell' (see below) a rent at Colton. In 1415 he shared in the French wars with his father (see p. 52), and was a Knight as early as 1413, . . . .
- Pg. 55
- . . John died on Jan. 17, 1448/9, according to an Inquisition post mortem which states he held no lands of the King in Nottinghamshire or Derbyshire.
- Sir John's wife was Elizabeth (not Margaret) daughter of Sir Thomas Clarell of Aldwark, Yorkshirew, by Matilda daughter of Sir Nicholas Montgomery. Her Christian name cannot be doubted in view of Gresely Charter 387, which appears to be a marriage settlement of the two, though Elizabeth is not expressly called the wife of John: the date is 1409-10. Elizabeth's name is also given in pedigrees in Brit. Mus. MSS. Harl. 4630 (p.94) and Add. 5530 (pp.xxvii, cii), and she had a sister Margaret.
- But confusion has arisen in the pedigrees and Visitations from it not having been seen that Sir John married a second wife whose name was Margaret. There can be little doubt that she was a daughter of John Norwood a merchant of Coventry and was three times married, 1. to Thomas Massey, son of Sir John Massey of Tatton in Cheshire by (Alice Worselay): this first husband died without issue Aug. 24, 1420: 2. to John de Delves (son of John), who had first married Philippa who died in 1420: John died in April 1429: 3. to Sir John Gresley in 1440-1. She survived her third husband, and occurs at least as late as March 1, 1448/9.
- Of Sir John's children it may be assumed that all were by his first wife, from considerations of date. Their names were:--
- 1. John (born 1418), see p. 57.
- 2. Nicholas, who occurs in 1450 as a witness (Nicholaus Gresley senior), and one more in 1455 in connexion with some riotous proceedings which will be noticed in the account of his brother Sir John.
- 3. Katherine, who is only mentioned as having married Sir William Peto (occ. 1430, d. 1464-5) who was a son of William de Peto (d. 1406-7) by Joan daughter of Sir John Thornbury and subsequently wife of Sir Robert Corbet. William and Katherine had a son John, jborn in about 1434 (d.1487-8), who in 1453-4 married Eleanor Mantfield.
- It is possible that this Katherine had previously married John Cawarden, of Mavesyn Ridware, before 1426, and had a son John and several other children by him: but as her husband survived her and married secondly Margaret Boteler and did not die till July 8, 1475, there is some unexplained mystery. Possibly there were two sisters Katherine, or conceivably a divorce.
- 4. Thomasine ? This lady is very difficult to place with certainty. She was certainly married to Hugh Wrottesley, who was born on Sept. 14, 1400: and the marriage was before 1421, for in that year she occurs in Katherine Walsh's Will as 'Thomasine Wrottesley.' Hugh died in 1464 and Thomasine on Dec. 25, 1480. Thomasine is definitely affirmed to be the daughter of Sir John Gresley, but was she daughter of this Sir John or of his great-grandfather whose second wife died in 1393?
- If she is daughter of the present Sir John, the difficutly is that we have seen above that he was probably married in 1409 (not before Sept. 30) or 1410, so that Thomasine could not have been born before 1410 and would have married before the age of twelve. Also it is odd that Katherine Walsh should have singled out this one great-grandchild and child-wife for remembrance in her will, the only other Gresley mentioned being her daughter.
- If she is daughter of the elder Sir John, there are no less difficulties. He was married before 1347 and seems to be holding property in 1328 and so was probably born not later than the latter year: if so Thomasine who died in 1480 would be a child of his old age. But we know of no issue of Sir John's second wife Joan, and if there was we must suppose Joan to have had two daughters by different husbands each named Thomasine. And how can we account for Joan making to mention of this Thomasine in her will?
- On the whole I believe that Thomasine was daughter of the second Sir John and married when very young, as is not unparalleled. If the authorities had shown any varition of her father's name, one might have inclined to believe her the daughter of Sir Nicholas or Sir Thomas.
- For Thomasin's children see the Wrottesley Pedigree, which is given at greater length than usual on account of its long unbroken male line and also of its certitude, the latter quality being the result of the researches of Major-General the Hon. George Wrottesley.
- http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/STANLEY3.htm#Anne STANLEY7
John Gresley, Sir's Timeline
Drakelowe, Derbyshire, England, United Kingdom
Of, Drakelow, Derbyshire, England
Of, Drakelow, Derbyshire, England
Drakelowe, Derbyshire, England
January 31, 1418
Colton, Staffordshire, England
January 31, 1418
Colton, Staffordshire, England, United Kingdom
January 17, 1449
April 19, 1930