Agatha de Ferrers

ALERT
1. As of 12 Aug 2022, Medilands does not support this person profile to the attached parentage.
2. A Wikitree profile argues two possible fathers: William vs. Robert.
3. Cokayne's volumes of the Complete Peerage makes no mention of her.
4. Unless a primary source is found to prove Agatha's parentage, her present parental linkage remains an insupportable presumption. — (Ken Shelley, 30 Aug 2022)
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Agatha de Ferrers Mistress of John I Lackland, King of England & possible mother of his illegitimate daughter Joan, who married Llewellyn "the Great"; Prince of Wales
Born ca.1167/72 Chartley, Stafforshire, England; d.19 Oct 1216 Aberconway, Caernarvonshire, Wales
Assumed Father William de Ferrers, 3rd Earl Derby1 b. c 1136, d. b 21 Oct 1190
Assumed Mother Sibyl de Braose b. c 1150, d. a 5 Feb 1228

Child # 6 of 12

1. William de Ferrers b.abt.1162
2. Ermintrude Ferrers b.abt.1163
3. Margery Ferrers b.abt.1165
4. Elizabeth de Ferrers b.abt.1166
5. Hugh de Ferrieres b.abt.1167 d.1204
6. Agatha de Ferrers b.abt.1168
7. Son de Ferrers b.ca.1168
8. Millicent de Ferrers b.abt.1170
9. Son de Ferrers b.ca.1170
10. Son de Ferrers b.ca.1172
11. Isabel de Ferrieres b.abt.1172 d.bef.May 31, 1252; bur.St. John Hospital Chruch, Lechlade, Gloucestershire, England; m. (1) abt. 1190 Roger de Mortimer; m. (2) abt. 1215 Piers FitzHerbert
12. Robert Ferrers b.abt.1177 d.1227

Family 1: Mistress of John I Lackland, King of England, Duke of Normandy, Count of Anjou (b. 24 Dec 1166, d. 19 Oct 1216) was the son of Henry II, King of England, 11th Count of Anjou, Duke of Normandy, Count of Maine & Aquitaine and Eleanor of Aquitaine.

Agatha Ferrers (concubine of John "Lackland, King of England) She did not marry John Lackland, King of England, Duke of Normandy, Count of Anjou. They had an affair when they both were young.

Notes: It is known that Agatha was a mistress of John, but it is only supposition that she is the mother of his child, Joan. Others suggest that Joan's mother was Clemence, the wife of Henry Pinel.

Comments

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~havens5/p23509.htm

Quote from a discussion of the Joan of England on Soc.Medieval-L.  The identity of Joan's mother is unknown. Agatha Ferrers is a nice guess, but is unsupported by contemporary evidence. The only time Joan's mother is mentioned by name is in the Tewkesbury Annals, where she is called "Queen Clementia". Is this a different name for Agatha Ferrers? Possibly, but not likely.

Should you take "Agatha Ferrers" out of your charts? Probably. What I would do is replace her with "Clementia, otherwise unidentified", and include a large footnote with all of the speculative identities for her, including Agatha Ferrers. Doug Richardson, taking "Clementia" as a name and not an epithet, has come up with some plausible, but not conclusive, evidence of who she might be (see other recent threads in this group). 

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Child #1: Joan of North Wales or Joanna Plantagenet of England (b. circa 1188 London, Middlesex, England; d. 30 Mar 1237 at: Abner, Carnarvonshire, Wales) was born illegitimately. She is the daughter of John I 'Lackland', King of England and Agatha de Ferrers .

Married: 18 Jun 1205, England; Llewelyn Fawr (Prince) of Gwynedd (Llywelyn "the Great"; Prince of Wales; Llywelyn ap Iorwerth (ap Jorweth) of North Wales (b. ca. 1173 Aberffraw Castle, Anglsy, North Wales; d. 11 Apr 1240, Aberconway, Carnarvonshire, Wales)

Children: (grandchildren of Agatha)
1. Elen (Helen, Helena) verch Llywelyn;
2. Angharad verch Llywelyn;
3. Dafydd ap Llywelyn

Possible Other Children:
4. Llewelyn (Prince) of North Wales
5. Gwladys Dhu "Dark eyed" verch Llewelyn
6. Margaret of Wales

Citations

1. Some Early English Pedigrees, by Vernon M. Norr, p. 68;

• http://fabpedigree.com
• http://www.multiwords.de/genealogy/Fe26%20William%20de%20Ferrers.html
• http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~jamesdow/s092/f502189.htm
• http://www.genpc.com/gen/files/d0023/f0000002.html#I1424 http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/FERRERS.htm
• http://thepeerage.com/p40720.htm#i407195

Note: The single cited source and the above URLs do contain no primary source RE her parentage. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Joan Plantagenet
Born: ABT 1188
Died: 2 Feb 1237, Aber
Notes: Others suggest her mother was Clemence, the wife of Henry Pinel.
Father: John I "Lackland" (King of England)
Mother: Agatha de Ferrers

Married 1: Llywelyn "the Great" ap Iowertg (Prince of Wales) (b. 1173 - d. 11 Apr 1240); m. 18 Jun 1205
Children:
1. Dafydd Ap LLYWELYN (Prince of Gwynedd) (m. Isabella De Braose)
2. Ellen Verch LLYWELYN
3. Angharad Verch LLYWELYN
4. Margaret Verch LLYWELYN (m.1 John De Braose - m.2 Walter Clifford)

Married 2: Geoffrey de NEVILLE AFT 1208
5. John de NEVILLE
6. Geoffrey de NEVILLE (Sir)
7. Agnes de NEVILLE
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CHILDREN of John and Agatha included:

Joan, Princess of England was born about 1188 in Of London, Middlesex, England. She died in Feb 1237 in Aberconwy, Arllechwedd Isaf, Caernarvonshire, Wales. She was buried in Llan-Faes, Dindaethwy, Anglesey, Wales.

Married #1. King Llewelyn Fawr "The Great" ap Iorwerth after 16 Apr 1205 in England.

They had the following children:
F i Gwladys "Ddu" verch Llewelyn
F ii Elen (Helen) verch Llewelyn 1 was born about 1206 in Of Caernarvonshire, Wales. She died before 24 Oct 1253 in Of Chester, Cheshire, England.
F iii Gwenllian "Las" verch Llywelyn 1 was born about 1207 in Of Caernarvonshire, Wales. She died .
M iv Prince Dafydd (David) ap Llywelyn
F v Margred (Margaret) (Marared) verch Llywelyn
F vi Angharad verch Llywelyn 1 was born about 1212 in Of Caernarvonshire, Wales. She died in infancy.

Married #2. Braose, William "Black William" de (Breos)