Thomas de Lancaster - parents - disconnect from Sir Robert Lawrence?

Erica Howton C

2/3/2016 at 2:27 PM

Notes in the profile read:

Surnames being the casual and unstable things they were at this early date, the Lawrences are also known as "de Lancaster". They are NOT to be confused with the Dukes or Earls of Lancaster!

"Thomas" is apparently his proper name, not "James" (who may be somebody else altogether). He was a son, possibly illegitimate, of Roger de Lancaster, not any "Sir Robert" (the "Crusader ancestor" appears to be a family myth - there was such a person but his connection to this family cannot be determined).

Exactly who he married is undocumented, but the "family tradition" is that his wife was Matilda de Wessyngton, married c. 1252.

The children of Lawrence de Lancaster (son of this Thomas) are said to have been the first to use "Lawrence" as a surname.

====

Erica Howton C

2/3/2016 at 2:29 PM

Private User this is the "top of the tree" you've been working on, so your opinion is particularly sought.

I haven't studied it enough but so far, the evidence seems to point towards a ROGER being the parent, and the "Sir Robert the crusader" an undetermined relative.

Tom Lawrence

2/8/2022 at 11:29 AM

New to research here. So I need to sort many things in question. In Burkes's book of commoners, and doomsday survey shows the crusader Robert was the son of Robert de Lancaster silversmith and jeweler to Baron de Lancaster.
Earlier research, I've read, on Lawrence who married Matilde was James.
Maybe someone can help me get on track here and point me to the right path. Any help with Roger de Lancaster would be helpful.
I'm not lazy and will take any direction and perform my due diligence.
thanks, Tommy

Erica Howton C

2/8/2022 at 11:48 AM

Notes in profile:

—-

Thomas de Lancaster was born say 1225. Thomas died circa 1292.

About 1247 the abbot and convent of Furness granted a toft to Thomas son of Roger de Lancaster in perpetual farm at 5s. rent; there was an oven on it.1 The estimated birth date of Thomas de Lancaster is based on this transaction. It would appear that Thomas may have been the eldest son of Roger de Lancaster, not a younger son as stated in The parentage of William de Lancaster, lord of Kendal by Washington.2 Thomas appears to have died circa 1292, about the same time as Roger de Lancaster or perhaps even before his father which may account for the lack of mention of Thomas as a heir of Roger. Also, was Thomas perhaps an illegitimate son of Roger, born before his marriage to Philippa de Bolebec?

http://www.lawrencefamhis.com/ashton-o/p230.htm#i5739

Thomas de Lancaster had two sons, John de Lancaster, the heir, who had no issue, and Lawrence de Lancaster, the eventual heir.

Erica Howton C

2/8/2022 at 11:50 AM

From The de Lancaster family of Rainhill, Lancashire

A Thomas de Lancaster, son of Roger, who is the ancestor of the Lawrences of Ashton, certainly had a son named John de Lancaster, but he seems to have died without heir, leaving his brother Lawrence to take over the estates of this family, in the countryside around Lancaster. I do not know of any involvement by this family in southern Lancashire in this period.

Thomas de Lancaster - parents - disconnect from Sir Robert Lawrence?

Participants:

Profiles Mentioned:

Create a free account or login to participate in this discussion