Ailsey Ann Rogers

Alsey (Alcy) was a Cherokee Woman

Biography

Alsey Falling's origins are somewhat uncertain, but it appears she was a Cherokee woman, the daughter of a white man named Ephraim "Rim" Falling and a Cherokee mother. She was the sister of John Falling, who was married to Nancy Vann and was the third wife of a white man named John Rogers. They were probably married in the early 1790's. Rogers stated in 1806 that his daughter Polly's mother was the sister of John Fawling, not James Vann. "he did not want to risk sending her...as the child's mother is Falling's sister." [1] This was shortly after James Vann had murdered John Fawling, husband of his sister Nancy Vann.

Marriage Husband John Rogers Wife Alsey Fawling. Child: @I658@. Child: Polly Ann Rogers. Marriage AFT 1780. Or 1786 in GA. [2]

Research Notes

• Many trees have her listed as a Vann, but the Moravian Diaries make it clear that she was a Falling.

The following is not correct.

• Husband John Joseph Vann.
• Wife UNKNOWN Wa-Wli.
• Child: @I909.
• Child: Nancy Vann.
• Child: @I1104@.
• Child: Alsey Vann.
• Child: James Clement Vann.
• Child: Avery Vann.
• Child: Mary B. Vann.
• Marriage 1763[3]

Sources

1. ↑ McClinton, Rowena. Moravian Springplace Mission to the Cherokees. University of Nebraska Press, Lincoln, NE. 2007 Vol. 1, p. 112
2. ↑ Source: #S663
3. ↑ Source: #S682

See also: Eastern Cherokee application 1306, great-granddaughter Joanah Barber.
Source: S663 Repository: #REPO2 A Brief Genealogy of the Samuel Felix Magee Family Note: acquired from Vada Pitts home; author unknown
Source: S679 genserv.com
Source: S682 oregontrail.net/~thomas

Source: The WikiTree Native American Project @ https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Fawling-10''
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AILSEY FAWLING (MARY4EMORY, MARY3GRANT, LUDOVIC2, JOHN1GRAUNT) was born Abt. 1770 in CNE [GA], and died in Georgia.
She married JOHN HELLFIRE ROGERS, SR Abt. 1794 in Georgia. He was born Abt. 1755.

On 6/30/1806 [Moravian Diaries] John Rogers who lived on the Hiawassee Riv, TN, came to Spring Place.He told the Moravians he wanted to put his 12 year old daughter [unnamed] into the school but her mother [unnamed] was the sister of John Fawling who had just been killed by James Vann in a duel.Rogers thought it unwise to rile Vann by having a Fawling in his neighborhood.

Thus the disputed story of Ailsey, sister of James Vann, who was the third wife of John Rogers [not listed in Starr] & had a daughter, Polly Ann, born about 1787 is VERY similar to this sister-in-law of James Vann who was the third wife of John Rogers [not listed in Starr] and the mother of a daughter born circa 1794.
Thus Ailsey would be Ailsey Fawling and Polly Ann Rogers would be her unnamed daughter.

• Clan: Ani'-Gilâ'hi = Twisters, Braids, or Long Hair Clan (Mary Grant)

Notes for JOHN HELLFIRE ROGERS, SR:
John started the Roger surname which includes Chief William Charles Rogers, Diana Rogers Houston (Sam Houston's wife) and Will Rogers. John's first wife was Elizabeth Due nee Emory and his second wife was his step-daughter Jennie Due.
The Texas Cherokee, p70;
...he [Samuel Houston] had married a Cherokee woman, Talihina (also known
as Diana) Rogers, daughter of John Jolly's brother, John Rogers.

• See notes on Questionable daughter, Polly Ann Rogers From Cherokee By Blood Vol 1 p. 398: shown below
• Blood: English
• Occupation: Trader

Child of AILSEY FAWLING and JOHN ROGERS is:
145. i. POLLY ANN6 ROGERS, b. Abt. 1794; d. 1852, Texas.

Source: Hicks, James R. “Cherokee Lineages: Register Report of Ludovic Grant” Genealogy.com, Sites.Rootsweb.com, 2023, https://www.genealogy.com/ftm/h/i/c/James-R-Hicks-VA/BOOK-0001/0015...
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Curator Note: the following is hypothetical, suggesting the origin of the story, but evidence now supports that Alcy aka Aisley was a Fawling, not a Vann, likely a daughter of Rim Fawling
From Jerry L. Clark December 04, 2001

“Many researchers have traced their Cherokee lineage to Alcey Vann, alleged sister or daughter of Chief James Vann, who was supposed to have married a Cherokee citizen (by marriage) John Rogers and a man named Pruitt.The daughter of this alliance was Polly Ann Rogers(1787-1856) who m. Samuel Dawson. Some versions of the story have Alcey Vann marrying Capt. John Rogers (mixed-blood son of "Hell-Fire Jack").

All accounts of Alcey are based on an application (#1306) of Joanna Barber to the Eastern Cherokee Roll (a.k.a. Guion Miller) Roll in 1908 and her testimony before the Dawes (Five Civilized Tribes) Commission. However, no contemporary document has yet been found to verify the existence of Alcey Vann.

There MAY be indirect evidence for her to be found in the Moravian Diaries. On June 30, 1806, a white man named John Rogers who lived on the Hiwassee River in TN visited Spring Place, GA. He was almost certainly "hell-Fire" Jack Rogers, whose 2 Cherokee wives (Elizabeth Emory & her daughter (by a previous marriage) Jennie Due) are listed in Dr. Emmet Starr's HISTORY OF THE CHEROKEE INDIANS (p.305) who lived at the time on the Hiwassee.Rogers told the Moravians that he wanted to enter his 12-year old daughter [unnamed] in to the Spring Place school, but the girl's mother [also unnamed] was a sister of John Falling. Since James Vann had been adverse to the marriage of his sister Nancy Vann to John Falling and had recently (May15, 1806) killed his brother-in-law in a duel, and was still angry at the Falling family, it was impolitic for Rogers to risk the enmity of Vann in placing the girl in the school.

• NOTE: The Crews and Starbuck editions of the Moravian Diaries are much more complete than Rowena McClinton's. The Moravians did not mention a name for Rogers' wife or the child in question; others have called them "Ailsey" and "Polly."

In 1819, Ruth Falling, daughter of John Falling & Nancy Vann, a student at Spring Place received a letter from her female cousin [unnamed], who was a pupil at Brainerd school at Chickamauga, TN.I have not found any record of a Rogers daughter attending the Brainerd school, but some of his children did attend a similar school run by Rev. Gideon Blackburn at the Hiwassee Garrison.

Thus the story of Alcy, sister of James Vann, who became the 3rd wife of John Rogers, & had a daughter Polly Ann(born ca. 1787) is mighty close to Ms. Falling, sister of the brother-in-law of James Vann, who was the 3rd wife of John Rogers, and whose daughter (born ca. 1794) & a 1st cousin of Ruth Falling. This does not prove the validity of Alcey & her daughter Polly, but suggests a possible origin to the story.

If this identification is correct, then Alcy was a descendant of a white man named Rim Falling (Curator note: Alcy was daughter of Rim Fawling), who married the mixed-blood Cherokee Mary Emory (sister of John Roger's older wife Elizabeth Emory) [Starr, p. 305] and NOT related to the better known Vann family. Incidently, the 2nd wife of John Rogers, Jennie Due, was a daughter of Indian trader Robert Due, whose 1779 letter to British agent Alexander Cameron mentioned 2 white men living among the Cherokees named John Vann and Joseph Vann. Jennie Due was the mother of Diana Rogers, who was the Cherokee wife of Gen. Samuel Houston (governor of Tennsee and President of the Lone Star Republic of Texas).”

Source: Clark, J. L. (2001, December 4). Alcey Vann. genealogy.com. Retrieved April 10, 2023, from https://www.genealogy.com/forum
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From Cherokee By Blood Vol 1 p. 398:
“Joanna Barber and 1 child, Crowell, TX. Rejected. It does not appear that any ancestor was a party to the treaties of 1835-6 and 1846.Nor does it appear that any ancestor was ever enrolled, or that any ancestor lived within the Cherokee domain.(Misc. Test. P. 3393) Applicant born in Arkansas in 1835.

MISC TEST. P. 3393. Isaac A. Barber: My name is Isaac A. Barber. I was born in 1830 and will be 78 years of age, the 17th of this month.I live at Crowell, TX. I am appearing here in the place of my wife, who is a claimant to participate in this fund, and who is too poorly to come. Her name is Joanane Barber, #1306, and she claims her Indian blood through her mother, Elizabeth Petty, who died in TX in 1873. She was born in the East, in GA. I think her mother Polly Ann Rogers, married Sam Dawson in GA and they lived there for a while and then moved west in 1835, or the last of them did.My wife's mother, Polly Ann Rogers first came west to Carroll County, AR in 1833, with her husband Sam Dawson, they thought that that was the Cherokee country at that time, as it was full of bear and deer. From AR, they later came to TX. They came to this State in 1848. I moved here in 1852. Polly Ann Rogers died in 1852, in December. I was with her when she died. She was possibly over 60 years of age. She was a 3/4 Cherokee and looked like a full blood. Her father was a white man also and he claimed no Indian blood. The mother of Polly Ann Rodgers was a full blood Cherokee Indian named Avery Vann, who lived and died in GA. Avery and Alcey Vann are the same, some call it Avery and others Alcey. Alcey Vann was alive in 1835, and that is as near as I can come to her time of living. I do not know when she died. My wife was born in Carroll Co, AR. among Cherokees of that locality. My wife's greatgrandmother, Alcey Vann got an allotment in GA and lived and died on this land. Polly Ann Rodgers moved west in 1833, as stated and into AR. They gave Avery Vann a privilege of taking land in GA and staying east or to come west as Polly Ann Rodgers did and take land here. Polly Ann Rodgers chose to come here while Alcey Vann stayed where she was. Polly Ann Rodgers got no money from the Government on account of her Indian blood in 1852. Capt. John Rodgers married Alcey Vann and helped to move the Indians west in 1835. He married Alcey Vann in GA. Capt. John Rodgers was 1/2 Cherokee Indian. He is on the 1835 and 1848 rolls. Polly Ann Rodgers was in TX is the reason she was not enrolled. Capt. John Rodgers is the greatgrandfather of my wife and through him, a 1/2 blood Cherokee, and through his wife Alcey Vann, a full blood Cherokee, both enrolled, we, my wife and children, and her family claim a right to share in this fund. SIGNED; Isaac A. Barber, Quanah, TX, 10/2/1908. EXCEPTION CASE. Rejected. Total number of exceptions filed in this group--7. Original recommendation renewed.”

Source: Jordan, J. W. (2019). Cherokee by Blood (Vol. 1, Applications 1-1550). Heritage Books, Inc., p. 398