Hawise de Grey

Parentage uncertain; Hawise and John have been placed under William (as grandfather) by process of elimination.

Hawisia de Grey vidua, pro animabus omnium antecessorum et consanguineorum, et precipue pro anima Johannis de Grey fratris mei quondam Norwicensis Episcopi, assensu Dni. Roberti de Grey filij et heredis mei, concessi et quantum ad patronam pertinet dedi Deo et Sce. Marie de Oseney et canonicis ibidem Deo servientibus ecclesiam de Cornewell ad donationem meam pertinentem in puram et perpetuam eleemosinam. Testibus Dno. Waltero de Grey, Wygorniensi Episcopus filio meo, &c.' [Blomefield, Norfok I:478, cites 'Mss. penes P. L. Norroy, p. 15, excerpt. e Cartis per Ric. St. George.']

Hawise de Grey widow, for the souls of all my ancestors and relatives, and [especially?] for the soul of John de Grey my brother, former Bishop of Norwich, with the assent of (Sir?) Robert de Grey my son and heir, give and donate [specified property to specified religious organizations - the Latin is a little dense here]. In witness [Right Reverend] Walter de Grey, Bishop of Worcester, my son.

The charter dates fairly precisely to 1215 - her brother John is deceased, but her son Walter is not yet Archbishop of York.

There has been some speculation on soc.genealogy.medieval that her husband was a John FitzAlan - this was before the FitzAlans had achieved *quite* as much importance as they would later.

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Hawise de Grey sister of John de Grey
(too old to reply) Simon Fairthorne via about a year ago Permalink Raw Message Report Have just found the following on the KCL Henry III Fine Rolls site

19 Sept. Rotherfield Greys. Concerning the lands of Hawise, who was the wife of John fitz Alan. Order to J. Lestrange, justice of Chester, to take into the king's hand all lands formerly of Hawise, who was the wife of John fitz Alan , which she held in dower in his bailiwick, unless he has previously taken them into the king's hand, and he is to keep them safely so that he answers for them at the Exchequer together with the other lands formerly of the same John that are in her custody. Witness W. archbishop of York.

Seems to me that this gives the father of Walter Archbishop of York which was one of the gaps in the discussion in December 2010 with John P Ravilious, John Watson and others

Am I right in this - for me this is unfamiliar territory

Regards

Simon

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On the other hand, this may refer to Hawise de Blancminster (?-c. 1242), second wife of John FitzAlan of Clun & Oswestry (?-c. 1240).

Parentage uncertain; Hawise and John have been placed under William (as grandfather) by process of elimination.

Hawisia de Grey vidua, pro animabus omnium antecessorum et consanguineorum, et precipue pro anima Johannis de Grey fratris mei quondam Norwicensis Episcopi, assensu Dni. Roberti de Grey filij et heredis mei, concessi et quantum ad patronam pertinet dedi Deo et Sce. Marie de Oseney et canonicis ibidem Deo servientibus ecclesiam de Cornewell ad donationem meam pertinentem in puram et perpetuam eleemosinam. Testibus Dno. Waltero de Grey, Wygorniensi Episcopus filio meo, &c.' [Blomefield, Norfok I:478, cites 'Mss. penes P. L. Norroy, p. 15, excerpt. e Cartis per Ric. St. George.']

Hawise de Grey widow, for the souls of all my ancestors and relatives, and [especially?] for the soul of John de Grey my brother, former Bishop of Norwich, with the assent of (Sir?) Robert de Grey my son and heir, give and donate [specified property to specified religious organizations - the Latin is a little dense here]. In witness [Right Reverend] Walter de Grey, Bishop of Worcester, my son.

The charter dates fairly precisely to 1215 - her brother John is deceased, but her son Walter is not yet Archbishop of York.

There has been some speculation on soc.genealogy.medieval that her husband was a John FitzAlan - this was before the FitzAlans had achieved *quite* as much importance as they would later.

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Hawise de Grey sister of John de Grey (too old to reply) Simon Fairthorne via about a year ago Permalink Raw Message Report Have just found the following on the KCL Henry III Fine Rolls site

19 Sept. Rotherfield Greys. Concerning the lands of Hawise, who was the wife of John fitz Alan. Order to J. Lestrange, justice of Chester, to take into the king's hand all lands formerly of Hawise, who was the wife of John fitz Alan , which she held in dower in his bailiwick, unless he has previously taken them into the king's hand, and he is to keep them safely so that he answers for them at the Exchequer together with the other lands formerly of the same John that are in her custody. Witness W. archbishop of York.

Seems to me that this gives the father of Walter Archbishop of York which was one of the gaps in the discussion in December 2010 with John P Ravilious, John Watson and others

Am I right in this - for me this is unfamiliar territory

Regards

Simon

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On the other hand, this may refer to Hawise de Blancminster (?-c. 1242), second wife of John FitzAlan of Clun & Oswestry (?-c. 1240).