Victor Francis Sunderland

Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 20 November 2019), memorial page for Victor Francis Sunderland (17 Mar 1896–21 Aug 1973), Find A Grave Memorial no. 13939513, citing Saint Johns Norway Cemetery and Crematorium, The Beaches, Toronto Municipality, Ontario, Canada ; Maintained by MsS Doré (contributor 46775354) .

(2019) Victor Francis Sunderland Encyclopedia Titanica (ref: #1245, updated 20th November 2019 12:09:13 PM) URL : https://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/titanic-survivor/victor-franc...

Mr Victor Francis Sunderland

• Titanic Survivor
• Born: Thursday 17th March 1892 in Upton Park, Essex, England
• Age: 20 years and 28 days (Male)
• Nationality: English
• Last Residence: in London London England
• Occupation: Farmer
• 3rd Class passengers
• First Embarked: Southampton on Wednesday 10th April 1912
• Ticket No. 392089 , £8 1s
• Destination: Cleveland. Ohio,United States
• Rescued: (Englehardt Boat "B")
• Disembarked Carpathia: New York City on Thursday 18th April 1912
• Died: Tuesday 21st August 1973 aged 81 years
• Cause of Death: Cause Not Disclosed
• Buried: St. John's Norway Cemetery, Toronto, Ontario, Canada
• Reference: https://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/titanic-lifeboat-b/ Englehardt Boat "B"
• Reference: https://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/titanic-deckplans/ R.M.S. Titanic deck pla

Mr Victor Francis Sunderland was born 17 March 1896. A resident of London he was travelling to Cleveland, Ohio to stay with his uncle, J. P. Foley. He boarded the Titanic at Southampton as a third class passenger (ticket number SOTON/OQ 392089 £8 1s). On the night of the collision, Sunderland was in his bunk in Section G (his cabin was three decks below the main deck and close to the bow). He and two cabin mates were smoking. Victor had on his trousers, his vest and coat were hanging on a rack. A little before midnight he felt a slight jar and heard a noise "similar to that (of) a basket of coal would make if dropped on an iron plate." Sunderland and six others went up the companion way to the main deck where a steward told them to go back. They could see ice on the deck, however the steward told them nothing was wrong so they went back to their cabin.

They lay down on their bunks again and smoked for a quarter of an hour more. Suddenly, water started pouring in under the door. They instantly something was very wrong, and three of them then ran back up to the main deck. The other men remained in bed. Sunderland thought they might have drowned.

Sunderland was told to return to his cabin to get his life preserver. They went back, but found their room was already under water. They ran aft between the decks and up to the main deck. There they found a Catholic priest praying and a crowd of men and women kneeling. Others were running about, beginning to panic. Sunderland separated from his two companions, they went aft to the taffrail. Sunderland went to the mid-promenade deck and then up to the boat deck.

He found the boat deck crowded along the starboard side. The crew was filling boats with women and children and lowering them away. Sunderland claimed that standing nearby him were the Straus's. An officer was trying to convince them to get into a boat, but Mrs Straus said, "Let me have my husband." When told that only she could get into the boat she replied, “Then I will die with him." Whether Sunderland actually saw this is uncertain, he also claimed to have seen an officer firing a revolver in the air once or twice and then shooting a man who had refused to get out of a boat.

Sunderland began to search for a lifebelt. He saw a steward in a lifeboat with three belts and asked him for one, but he refused. Sunderland asked a crew member if he knew where he could find one, and the crewmember didn't know. The ship was beginning to list to port and the boats along the starboard were almost all gone. The passengers were moving to the port side, but were kept back by crewmembers.

Sunderland stayed close to the front of the boat deck, where Second Officer Lightoller and several fireman were trying to launch Collapsible B. Water was gushing toward him. The front of the boat began to rapidly sink. The firemen began jumping overboard. Sunderland followed. He swam away and found Boat B floating next to the sinking Titanic, washed overboard. He grabbed onto it as it floated near the forward funnel, moments later the funnel fell down. Sunderland thought the ship broke in two at that time.

Sunderland and about 27 or 28 other men climbed onto Boat B. Many others were pushed away, trying to keep the boat from being overloaded. He was waist deep in the water. Someone asked how many Catholics were onboard. This person began to say the Lord's Prayer and then the Hail Mary, with the others following.

In the early morning, they spotted the Carpathia and Lightoller signalled boat 12 to take them off. Sunderland was the fifth person to climb off of boat B. On the Carpathia, he recalled being given cold coffee.

After arriving in New York, he was taken to the Salvation Army home and fed and clothed. He was then briefly hospitalized at St. Vincent's Hospital, where he remained until 20 April. From the 20th until the 24th, Sunderland went to the White Star offices and tried to recover money he had lost in the wreck. He also "saw the sights." He travelled by train to Cleveland and showed up at his uncle's house unexpectedly on 26 April.

He was later married to May Annie McNaughton and worked as a plumber until his retirement in 1939. He settled in Toronto, Canada in the 1920s and died there on 21 August 1973.

References and Sources Toronto Daily Star, 22 August 1973, Death Notice Province of Ontario Statement of Death Cleveland Plain Dealer (Ohio), 20, 23, 26 April 1912 Contract Ticket List, White Star Line 1912 (National Archives, New York; NRAN-21-SDNYCIVCAS-55[279])

Credits Phillip Gowan, USA Homer Thiel, USA

• Reference: FamilySearch Family Tree - SmartCopy: Oct 20 2019, 14:41:52 UTC

Victor Sunderland was aboard the RMS Titanic.Victor, born in 1892. was probably the son of James William Sunderland, a house decorator in West Ham, Essex, and his wife Maria Foley, who were married in 1889. As a young man, he survived the sinking of the

• Reference: WikiTree Genealogy - SmartCopy: Oct 20 2019, 14:48:10 UTC

"I saw an officer fire his revolver once or twice, killing a man" he then heard another shot and "asked what had happened, and a gentlemen told me that an officer had shot himself." --Mr Victor Francis Sunderland - Third Class passenger

from the Cleveland Plain Dealer, Friday, April 26, 1912 STICKS TO TITANIC TILL LAST MINUTE

  -----------------  Young Englishman Reaches Cleveland and Relates Story of Disaster. 

  -----------------  Saw Man Shot Dead and Mrs. Straus Refuse to Desert Husband. 

  -----------------  REPEATED LORD'S PRAYER 

  -----------------  United With Other Men on Raft, Mostly Catholics, in Appealing to Heaven -- Floated Waist Deep in Water With Col. Gracie, Officer Lightoller, Operator Bride and Others Awaiting Rescue -- Tells of Captain Giving Away Life Belt. 

  ---------------- 

Afloat six hours on an overturned lifeboat with twenty-nine others--the last man to leave the boat deck of the doomed Titanic after she crashed into the iceberg that sent her to the bottom, Victor Sunderland of London, England reached Cleveland last night.

Sunderland, 20 years old, saw Mr. and Mrs. Isador Straus go to their death together; saw the first officer of the Titanic shoot dead a man who refused to give up his place in a lifeboat to a woman; leaped to the icywater with Second Officer Lightoller and found a place on the overturned lifeboat that proved a harbor of refuge for Col. Archibald Gracie.

He joined in the prayer offered up by the thirty on the fragile craft and a few minutes later was aiding in the work of pushing back those who sought to climb aboard when the boat was already overcrowded. He was one of the very few third class passengers to survive.

The young Englishman is a nephew of J. P. Foley, 8917 Superior-av N. E., where he is to make his future home. Although he landed with the Carpathia a week ago last night, no direct word was received from him. A score of telegrams purporting to be from him were proved on his own statement to have been sent by officials of St. Vincent's hospital, New York, from the time he landed until last Saturday afternoon.

Confirm's Gracie's Story

A telegram from the White Star Line Tuesday morning led his relatives here to the Euclid-av station of the Pennsylvania railroad Wednesday, but a later telegram from the same source stated that he would not leave until Thursday. Without previous word Sunderland appeared at his uncle's home last evening.

Sunderland's story of his escape from the sinking ship and his experience in the icy water before being picked up by the Carpathia tallies exactly with that others have told. Although he knew the names of none of his companions on the overturned boat except Second Officer Lightoller, with whom he had jumped, the incidents he set forth last night correspond with the story told by Col. Gracie.

"I lay on my bunk in Section G, third deck from the main deck, at 10 o'clock that Sunday night," said Sunderland last night. "Three of us were smoking. I had on my trousers. My coat and vest were hanging on a rack. A little before midnight we felt a slight jar and heard a noise similar to that a basket of coals would make if dropped on an iron plate. Seven of us ran up the companionway to the maion deck, where a steward told us to go back. We saw a number of pieces of ice on the deck, but he said there was nothing wrong, so we went back."

"We laid down in our bunks again and smoked for about a quarter of an hour. Suddenly one of us noticed water pouring into the section under the door. This time we knew something was wrong and three of us again ran up, but only to the first deck. The others were asleep, and I guess they were drowned."

"An officer stopped us there and told us to go back and get life preservers. Those preservers were located in racks over the bunks. When we got back we found the section full of water -- twenty feet of it -- and we had no chance toget our life belts. We ran aft between decks and up to the main deck."

"On the main deck there was a Catholic priest praying and around him was a crowd of men and women. Some were kneeling and some were running around screaming. I looked over the side and saw that the ship had stopped. It was about on an even keel then. At that point we three separated. I went from the main deck to the promenade deck amidships and the other two went aft to the taffrail. They were drowned as were the others in my section."

"Then I went to the boat deck. The boat deck was crowded on the starboard side. The crew was filling the boats with women and children and lowering them away. An old lady and an old man with a white beard stood together. An officer told the woman to get into a boat. She put her arm around her husband's shoulder and said, 'Let me have my husband.' When she was told she must go alone, she said, 'Then I will die with him.' That was the last I saw of them."

"In one boat, partly filled with women, a man sat--I think he was a Russian. An officer told him to get out, but he wouldn't. The officer fired his revolver one or twice and still the man sat there. The officer then shot him and he dropped back in his seat. He was lifted up and dropped overboard."

"I began to look for a lifebelt and I saw a steward in one boat with three lifebelts strapped about his body. I asked him to give me one, but he refused. I asked an officer where I could get one, but he said he didn't know. Capt. Smith stood near us, and I asked him."

"'I don't know where you can get one now,' he said. 'I have given mine away.'"

"He was a brave man. He seemed to be everywhere, always trying to get the women and children off."

"The ship had begun to list to port by that time and the boats on the starboard side were nearly all gone. The passengers rushed to the port side, but were crowded back by the crew to keep the boat even. The captain ordered all boats to row away from the ship. The ship began to sink by the head and by then the boat deck was clear of all but Lightoller, two firemen and myself."

"The ship had dropped down in the water until the boat deck was awash and the officer, fireman and myself tried to lower away a boat that stood in the blocks on the starboard side. The water was then gushing up through the gangway through which the firemen enter and leave the fire room. Just as we had the boat ready to lower the ship trembled and dropped suddenly. The firemen jumped over the starboard side."

"'Here she goes," shouted Lightoller and jumped over the port side. I followed."

"A lifeboat, bottomside up and evidently one of those which had overturned under its load, floated up to the rail and we grabbed for it. We climbed upon it and it drifted over the submerged part of the Titanic. We passed under the forward funnel and just as we were clear it fell. At that minute the Titanic broke in two just aft of amidships and the stern stood straight in the air."

"'Make for the stern. It looks like she will float,' Lightoller shouted, but just as he spoke the stern plunged down."

The twenty minutes that followed, Sunderland said, were marked by cries and screams for help, then all was quiet. In all, twenty-eight other swimmers climbed aboard the overturned boat and scores of others were thrust back into the water when they tried to climb on. Harold Bride, second wireless operator on the Titanic, was one of those who found a place on the boat. The survivors worked their way from the stern and distributed themselves over the bottom so as best to keep afloat and waist deep they stood for six hours."

"Someone asked how many Catholics there were on board," said Sunderland. "Nearly all were Catholics, and the man who spoke began to say the Lord's Prayer. Then he said the Hail Mary. We followed. About daylight we sighted the Carpathia and it was about that time Lightoller shouted for the other boats to pick us up. I was the fifth man to leave our boat and I got into one rowed by women, some dressed and others half dressed. There were seventy-two in our boat."

"We found that two of those on the overturned boat were dead when we were picked up and three men in the boat that got us died before we reached the Carpathia. Lightoller kept us from drowning before we were picked up. He made us keep steady."

When the Carpathia was reached five babies were taken from Sunderland's boat and lifted to the liner's deck in ashbags. Women and exhausted men were taken up in bo'sun's chairs. Cold coffee was all the third class survibors were given for the first two hours on the Carpathia.

In New York Sunderland was taken to the Salvation army home, fed and clothed and then taken to St. Vincent's hospital, where he remained until Saturday. From Saturday until Wednesday night he made attempts to obtain from the White Star line information that would lead him to the recovery of money he had lost in the wreck, but without success. His case is now in the hands of New York attorneys.

Encyclopedia Titanica Cleveland Plain Dealer (26 April 1912) Mr Victor Francis Sunderland was born 17 March 1896. A resident of London he was travelling to Cleveland, Ohio to stay with his uncle, J. P. Foley. He boarded the Titanic at Southampton as a third class passenger (ticket number SOTON/OQ 392089 £8 1s). On the night of the collision, Sunderland was in his bunk in Section G (his cabin was three decks below the main deck and close to the bow). He and two cabin mates were smoking. Victor had on his trousers, his vest and coat were hanging on a rack. A little before midnight he felt a slight jar and heard a noise "similar to that (of) a basket of coal would make if dropped on an iron plate." Sunderland and six others went up the companion way to the main deck where a steward told them to go back. They could see ice on the deck, however the steward told them nothing was wrong so they went back to their cabin.

They lay down on their bunks again and smoked for a quarter of an hour more. Suddenly, water started pouring in under the door. They instantly something was very wrong, and three of them then ran back up to the main deck. The other men remained in bed. Sunderland thought they might have drowned.

Sunderland was told to return to his cabin to get his life preserver. They went back, but found their room was already under water. They ran aft between the decks and up to the main deck. There they found a Catholic priest praying and a crowd of men and women kneeling. Others were running about, beginning to panic. Sunderland separated from his two companions, they went aft to the taffrail. Sunderland went to the mid-promenade deck and then up to the boat deck.

He found the boat deck crowded along the starboard side. The crew was filling boats with women and children and lowering them away. Sunderland claimed that standing nearby him were the Straus's. An officer was trying to convince them to get into a boat, but Mrs Straus said, "Let me have my husband." When told that only she could get into the boat she replied, "Then I will die with him." Whether Sunderland actually saw this is uncertain, he also claimed to have seen an officer firing a revolver in the air once or twice and then shooting a man who had refused to get out of a boat.

Sunderland began to search for a lifebelt. He saw a steward in a lifeboat with three belts and asked him for one, but he refused. Sunderland asked a crew member if he knew where he could find one, and the crewmember didn't know. The ship was beginning to list to port and the boats along the starboard were almost all gone. The passengers were moving to the port side, but were kept back by crewmembers.

Sunderland stayed close to the front of the boat deck, where Second Officer Lightoller and several fireman were trying to launch Collapsible B. Water was gushing toward him. The front of the boat began to rapidly sink. The firemen began jumping overboard. Sunderland followed. He swam away and found Boat B floating next to the sinking Titanic, washed overboard. He grabbed onto it as it floated near the forward funnel, moments later the funnel fell down. Sunderland thought the ship broke in two at that time.

Sunderland and about 27 or 28 other men climbed onto Boat B. Many others were pushed away, trying to keep the boat from being overloaded. He was waist deep in the water. Someone asked how many Catholics were onboard. This person began to say the Lord's Prayer and then the Hail Mary, with the others following.

In the early morning, they spotted the Carpathia and Lightoller signalled boat 12 to take them off. Sunderland was the fifth person to climb off of boat B. On the Carpathia, he recalled being given cold coffee.

After arriving in New York, he was taken to the Salvation Army home and fed and clothed. He was then briefly hospitalized at St. Vincent's Hospital, where he remained until 20 April. From the 20th until the 24th, Sunderland went to the White Star offices and tried to recover money he had lost in the wreck. He also "saw the sights." He travelled by train to Cleveland and showed up at his uncle's house unexpectedly on 26 April.

He was later married to May Annie McNaughton and worked as a plumber until his retirement in 1939. He settled in Toronto, Canada in the 1920s and died there on 21 August 1973.

Additional Articles Toronto Daily Star, 22 August 1973, Death Notice

• Reference: Find A Grave Memorial - SmartCopy: Oct 20 2019, 19:16:32 UTC
• Reference: Full text- https://archive.org/details/truthabouttitani00grac/page/n6 "The Truth About the Titanic" by Colonel Archibald Gracie, IV 1913 pp. 209-224

ENGELHARDT BOAT "B"

{The Upset Boat']

Passengers: A. H. Barkworth, Archibald Gracie, John B. Thayer, Jr., first cabin.

Crew: Second Officer Lightoller, Junior Marconi Operator Bride, Firemen: McGann, Senior; Chief Baker Joughin; Cooks: Collins, Maynard; Steward Whiteley, "J. Hagan." Seaman J. McGough (possibly). Two men died on boat. Body of one transferred to No. 12 and finally to Carpathia, He was a fireman probably, but Cunard Co. preserved no record of him or his burial.

INCIDENTS

C. H. Lightoller, Second Officer (Am. Inq., pp. 87, 91, 786) :

I was on top of the officers' quarters and there was nothing more to be done. The ship then took a dive and I turned face forward and also took a dive from on top, practically amidships a little to the starboard, where I had got to. I was driven back against the blower, which is a large thing that shape (indicating) which faces forward to the wind and which then goes down to the stoke hole ; but there is a grating there and it was against this grating that I was sucked by the water, and held there under water. There was a terrific blast of air and water and I was blown out clear. I came up above the water, which barely threw me away at all, because I went down again against these fiddley gratings immediately abreast of the funnel over the stoke hole to which this fiddley leads. Colonel Grade, I believe, was sucked down in identically the same manner on the fiddley gratings, caused by the water rushing down below as the ship was going down.

I next found myself alongside of that overturned boat. This was before the Titanic sank. The funnel then fell down and if there was anybody on that side of the Engelhardt boat it fell on them. The ship was not then submerged by considerable. The stern was completely out of the water. I have heard some controversy as to the boilers exploding owing to coming in contact with salt water, by men who are capable of giving an opinion, but there seems to be an open question as to whether cold water actually does cause boilers to explode.

I hardly had any opportunity to swim. It was the action of the funnel falling that threw us out a considerable distance away from the ship. We had no oars or other effective means for propel- ling the overturned boat. We had little bits of wood, but they were practically ineffective.

On our boat, as I have said before, were Colonel Gracie and young Thayer. I think they were the only two passengers. There were no women on our overturned boat. These were all taken out of the water and they were firemen and others of the crew — roughly about thirty. I take that from my own estimate and from the estimate of someone who was looking down from the bridge of the Carpathia,

And from the same officer's testimony before the British Court as follows :

An order was given to cut the lashings of the other Engelhardt boats. It was then too late as the water was rushing up to the Boat Deck and there was not time to get them to the falls. He then went across to the officers' quarters on the starboard side to see what he could do. Then the vessel seemed to take a bit of a dive. He swam off and cleared the ship. The water was so intensely cold that he first tried to get out of it into the crow's nest, close at hand. Next he was pushed up against the blower on the forepart of the funnel, the water rushing down this blower, holding him against the grating for a while. Then there seemed to be a rush of air and he was blown away from the grating. He was dragged below the surface, but not for many moments. He came up near the Engelhardt boat *'B" which was not launched, but had been thrown into the water. The forward funnel then fell down. Some little time after this he saw half a dozen men standing on the collapsible boat, and got on to it. The whole of the third funnel was still visible, the vessel gradually raising her stern out of the water. The ship did not break in two, and could not be broken in two. She actually attained the perpendicular before sinking. His impression was that no lights were then burning in the after part not submerged. It is true that the after part of the vessel settled level with the water. He watched the ship keenly all the time. After she reached an angle of 60 degrees there was a rumbling sound which he attributed to the boilers leaving their beds and crashing down. Finally she attained an absolute perpendicular position and then went slowly down. He heard no explosion whatever, but noticed about that time that the water became much warmer. There were about those on the Engelhardt boat *'B, several people struggling in the water who came on it. Nearly twenty-eight or thirty were taken off in the morning at daybreak. In this rescuing boat (No. 12), after the transfer, there were seventy-five. It was the last boat to the Carpathia. The next morning (Monday) he saw some icebergs from fifty to sixty to two hundred feet high, but the nearest was about ten miles away.

After the boats had left the side of the ship he heard orders given by the commander through the megaphone. He heard him say: "Bring that boat alongside." Witness presumed allusion was made to bringing of boats to the gangway doors. Witness could not gather whether the orders were being obeyed. Said he had not been on the Engelhardt boat more than half an hour before a swell was distinctly visible. In the morning there was quite a breeze. It was when he was at No. 6 boat that he noticed the list. Though the ship struck on the starboard side, it was not an extraordinary thing that there should be a list to port. It does not necessarily follow that there should be a list to the side where the water was coming in.

Harold Bride, junior Marconi operator in his Report of April 27th to W. B. Cross, Traffic Manager, Marconi Co. (Am. Inq., p. 1053), says:

Just at this moment the captain said: *'You cannot do any more; save yourselves.*' Leaving the captain we climbed on top of the house comprising the officers' quarters and our own. Here I saw the last of Mr. Phillips, for he disappeared, walking aft. I now assisted in pushing off the collapsible boat on to the Boat Deck. Just as the boat fell, I noticed Captain Smith dive from the bridge into the sea. Then followed a general scramble out on to the Boat Deck, but no sooner had we got there than the sea washed over. I managed to catch hold of the boat we had previously fixed up and was swept overboard with her, I then experienced the most exciting three or four hours anyone can reasonably wish for, and was, in due course with the rest of the survivors, picked up by the Carpathia, As you probably heard, I got on the collapsible boat the second time, which was, as I had left it, upturned. I called PhilHps but got no response. I learned later from several sources that he was on this boat and expired even before we were picked up by the Titanic' s lifeboat (No. 12). I am told that fright and exposure were the causes of his death. So far as I can find out, he was taken on board the Carpathia and buried at sea from her, though for some reason the bodies of those who died were not identified before burial from the Carpathia, and so I cannot vouch for the truth of this.

He also gave testimony before the American Inquiry (pp. no, 161) :

This boat was over the officers' cabin at the side of the forward funnel. It was pushed over on to the Boat Deck. It went over the starboard side and I went over with it. It was washed off and over the side of the ship by a wave into the water bottom side upward. I was inside the boat and under it, as it fell bottom side upward. I could not tell how long. It seemed a life time to me really. I got on top of the boat eventually. There was a big crowd on top when I got on. I should say that I remained under the boat three- quarters of an hour, or a half hour. I then got away from it as quickly as I could. I freed myself from it and cleared out of it but I do not know why, but swam back to it about three-quarters of an hour to an hour afterwards. I was upside down myself — I mean I was on my back.

It is estimated that there were between thirty and forty on the boat; no women. When it was pushed over on the Boat Deck we all scrambled down on to the Boat Deck again and were going to launch it properly when it was washed over before we had time to launch it. I happened to be nearest to it and I grabbed it and went down with it. There was a passenger on this boat; I could not see whether he was first, second or third class. I heard him say at the time that he was a passenger. I could not say whether it was Colonel Gracie. There were others who struggled to get on; dozens of them in the water. I should judge they were all part of the boat's crew.

I am twenty-two years old. Phillips was about twenty-four or twenty-five. My salary from the Marconi Co. is four pounds a month.

As to the attack made upon Mr. Phillips to take away his life belt I should say the man was dressed like a stoker. We forced him away. I held him and Mr. Phillips hit him.

J. Collins, cook (Am. Inq., p. 628) :

This was my first voyage. I ran back to the upper deck to the port side with another steward and a woman and two children. The steward had one of the children in his arms and the woman was crying. I took the child from the woman and made for one of the boats. Then the word came around from the starboard side that there was a collapsible boat getting launched on that side and that all women and children were to make for it, so the other steward and I and the two children and the woman came around to the starboard side. We saw the collapsible boat taken off the saloon deck, and then the sailors and the firemen who were forward saw the ship's bow in the water and that she was sinking by her bow. They shouted out for us to go aft. We were just turning round to make for the stern when a wave washed us off the deck — washed us clear of it, and the child was washed out of my arms. I was kept down for at least two or three minutes under water.

Senator Bourne: Two or three minutes?

Mr. Collins: Yes; I am sure.

Senator Bourne: Were you unconscious?

Mr. Collins : No ; not at all. It did not affect me much — the salt water.

Senator Bourne: But you were under water? You cannot stay under water two or three minutes.

Mr. Collins : Well, it seemed so to me. I could not exactly state how long. When I came to the surface I saw this boat that had been taken off. I saw a man on it. They had been working on it taking it off the saloon deck, and when the wave washed it off the deck, they clung to it. Then I made for it when I came to the surface, swimming for it. I was only four or five yards off of it. I am sure there were more than fifteen or sixteen who were then on it. They did not help me to get on. They were all watching the ship. All I had to do was to give a spring and I got on to it. We were drifting about for two hours in the water.

Senator Bourne: When you came up from the water on this collapsible boat, did you see any evidence of the ship as she sank then?

Mr. Collins: I did, sir; I saw her stern end.

Senator Bourne: Where were you on the boat at the time you were washed off the ship?

Mr. Collins: Amidships, sir.

Senator Bourne : You say you saw the stern end after you got on the collapsible boat?

Mr. Collins: Yes, sir.

Senator Bourne: Did you see the bow?

Mr. Collins : No, sir.

Senator Bourne : How far were you from the stern end of the ship when you came up and got on to the collapsible boat?

Mr. Collins : I could not just exactly state how far I was away from the Titanic when I came up. I was not far, because her hghts were out then. Her lights went out when the water got almost to amidships on her.

Senator Bourne: As I understand it, you were amidships of the bow as the ship sank?

Mr. Collins: Yes, sir.

Senator Bourne: You were washed off by a wave? You were under water as you think for two or three minutes and then swam five or six yards to the collapsible boat and got aboard the boat? The stern (of ship) was still afloat?

Mr. Collns: The stern was still afloat.

Senator Bourne: The lights were burning?

Mr. Collins: I came to the surface, sir, and I happened to look around and I saw the lights and nothing more, and I looked in front of me and saw the collapsible boat and I made for it.

Senator Bourne: How do you account for this wave that washed you off amidships ?

Mr. Collins: By the suction which took place when the bow went down in the water. There were probably fifteen on the boat when I got on. There was some lifeboat that had a green light on it and we thought it was a ship, after the Titanic had sunk, and we commenced to shout. All we saw was the green light. We were drifting about two hours, and then we saw the topmast lights of the Carpathia. Then came daylight and we saw our own lifeboats and we were very close to them. When we spied them we shouted to them and they came over to us and they lifted a whole lot of us that were on the collapsible boat.