Geni's policy of detaching mythological profiles from the Tree and have them in isolation

Started by Lord Bruce Ross Myers on Tuesday, September 21, 2021
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9/21/2021 at 8:32 PM

These people that are real people, the profile, some different language has different spelling, are isolated, these are the rules of Geni, Have found matching profile that are the same people but one is German spelling of the name and isolated. So my questions is just because these people did great things and they said they are gods and fairytales this is what people made up, these people just because people did stories about over exaggerating someone, they get isolated from the tree, we want to bring back the isolated profiles back into the tree, these are the Royalty connections, without these profiles put back into the tree, the past will be lost, is that what Geni wants, for us not to find our past to Royalty? What can be done to take the isolation off of the profiles, the world is changing and it is time to take the block off.

All comments welcome

Lord Bruce

9/22/2021 at 3:31 AM

Thanks for starting a new thread for this discussion!

I think two things are going on —

One is that it has for a while now been the policy to isolate duplicate medieval lines and send them to Customer Service, where they get deleted. This is because the amount of work that they cause in the form of tree conflicts, data conflicts, and fixing errors is astronomical. But since the lines are merged into the Tree before the tops are cut off, the users who have created the duplicates are still connected to their ancestors.

The second is that it has also been the policy for a while now to detach mythological profiles from the tops of the lines. It is true that we used to keep them there, and just label them as fictional, but there were a great many complaints from people who did not think that fictional profiles should be among their ancestors. So the decision was made that the Tree be composed of humans only, as far as possible.

The reason that so many easily available genealogies give lines that go back into mythology is that the early genealogies in large part were meant to show the exalted origins of noble or royal houses. So they connected their human ancestors to legendary figures, and deities. So that is why you can find genealogies that show historical humans as descended from Beli Mawr the sun god, or Frejya and Odin, or Atlas.

What we do now is keep those lines isolated and labeled fictional, with notes and links at the top of the human tree to explain how they were connected in the past.

9/22/2021 at 6:34 AM

Thanks Anne for addressing this, is there any customer service here from Geni? The father is deleted so he has no parents and most of the time, it says in this case King, so it has no past, are you the customer service, I knew that stuff, just when you merge profiles, it is put back, no confusion here, this is just like merging someone other than Royalty.

Isolate duplicate ( THIS IS WHY WE MERGE ) medieval lines and send them to Customer Service, where they get deleted. ( They are real people )

Form of tree conflicts, data conflicts, and fixing errors, ( well when the people make up profile creating there own trees, we merge and and fix duplicates.

Lines are merged into the Tree ( made by the users ) before the tops are cut off, 9 You take the parents off the profile so no link to there past is snipped ) the users who have created the ( Profile of there ancestors, to match and merge there input ) duplicates are still connected to their ancestors. ( yes they would be cause they put the ancestors on it so it can be merged )

Detach mythological profiles ( These are real People ) real trees, ( cut the fathers and mothers off ) from the tops of the lines. It is true that we used to keep them there, ( the mom's and Dad's to find there past ) and just label them as fictional, ( When they are real people ) but there were a great many complaints from people 9 Saying they are not real cause they said things that are fictional, but they over exaggerated things about them that are not true like magic and things ) who did not think that fictional profiles ( real people ) should be among their ancestors, ( of Royalty and Gods that they are real people )

Decision was made that the Tree be composed of humans only, ( but they are humans ) as far as possible ( to disconnect the non- humans from real people that are real people ) not made up, what makes me up or any of my ancestor's is that it is to be merged, I am just like the medieval tree myself and not a god I am a real person, I don't want to be in the medieval tree and they snip me from it.

Reason that so many easily available genealogies ( easy available tree ) give lines that go back into mythology ( to the past as everyone goes to the past to fix it, that would correct the future ) is that the early genealogies ( is real history of people past ) in large part we were meant to show the exalted origins (exalted opinion of himself ) of noble or royal houses, so we can't find our nobility past ) . So they connected their human ancestors to legendary figures, That are ( exalted opinions of himself, and separate the real people from the trees, cause they are over exaggerated real people, that should be in the tree, not to be deleted ) and deities. Gods that are real people just ( exalted opinion of himself )

you can find genealogies that show historical humans as descended from Beli Mawr the sun god, or Frejya and Odin, or Atlas. ( that Geni used ( USED TO ) to have a link to but, isolated now with no connection to what was real people, now exalted opinion of themselves.

What we do now is keep those lines isolated and labeled fictional ( the real people, now exalted opinion of themselves, so if we talk highly of someone they will isolate them, not to be real people but they are?

Curators on Geni put notes and links at the top of the human tree of people that are isolated to explain how they were connected in the past. ( I see nothing telling me of the parents of the isolated tree ( now exalted opinion of themselves ) of the notes and links at the top of the human tree to explain how they were connected in the past. The people have no connection it is lost ( no connection to the past when you connect to the ( now exalted opinion of themselves ) deleted snipped, disconnected so the tree comes to an end because they are now exalted from themselves.

My question, why would it be isolated, the real people EXALTED from the opinions of our people make them isolate, they are human just like me and everyone else in the tree should be treat equal, not now exalted opinion of themselves, which means they are real but to good to be true, so we snip it from the tree, this is wrong, we need to put them back into the tree so people can find there past, not to isolate and not be connected cause real people are there to connect the dots.

Lets not hide the real people, connect them back to the tree

The explanation is not a good reason to disconnect the people from the real tree, bring them back this was only done 2 to 3 years ago

The question here is, I want the isolations to be removed, ( Because there is no valid reason that there should not be anyone real or not snipped and isolated when these are real people not to separate from the are exalted but real people trying to make them as if they are not real, Please

Put them back please

Lord Bruce out

Can you put them back, please

9/22/2021 at 7:23 AM

Lord Bruce Ross Myers -- Mythological figures are not humans. They are ideas, in human form. They did not have bodies, and they are not physical ancestors. They are metaphorical ancestors.

Here is the human ancestor, the top of this tree, which was detached from Beli Mawr -- Caswallan Cassivellaunos ap Beli, King of the Catuvellauni -- as you can see, there is a link to Beli Mawr in the Overview.

There are actual humans in the dupllicate lines; they are already in the Tree.

Mike Stangel -- are you able to clarify this further?

thanks, Anne

9/22/2021 at 7:33 AM
  • Genealogy is different to mythology. You can use a personal family tree programme to show mythological profiles in your family line. Why not try that?
  • Duplicated profiles high up in the Medieval Tree aren't merged in because of the workload created by knock on merges. Anyone, not just exalted people, can request management on the originals.

Perhaps you should ask Customer Service to clarify for you the reason they created the Isolation Tool. Customer Service

9/22/2021 at 9:59 AM

Kaiser des Heiligen Römischen Reiches Maximilian I von Österreich

Maximilian I von Habsburg, Archduke of Austria, Emperor of the Holy Roman Empire of the German Nation

Holy Roman Emperor Maximilian I of Austria (von Habsburg)

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximilian_I._(HRR)

This is deleted, not to add cause this is the same family!

Konrad Ernst Maximilian Graf von Hochberg-Furstenstein

Maximilian I of Habsburg (March 22, 1459 – January 12, 1519) was Holy Roman Emperor from 1508 until his death, but had ruled jointly with his father for the last ten years of his reign, from circa 1483. He expanded the influence of the House of Habsburg through both war and marriage[1], but also lost the Austrian territories in today's Switzerland in the battle of Dornach 22 July 1499, where the Swiss won a final decisive victory. King Maximilian I had no choice but to agree to a peace treaty signed on 22 September 1499 in Basel granting the Swiss Confederacy de facto far-reaching independence from the Habsburgs. He is often referred to as "The Last Knight".

9/22/2021 at 10:21 AM

The customer service is WIKI, what will that do? Sharon Doubell

9/22/2021 at 10:23 AM

Maximilian is a real person, but isolated now deleted, but you can't merge cause it links to royalty, we not hiding the links to the past??

9/22/2021 at 12:23 PM

Emperor and King, King Maximilian I see this is my Meyer lineage the strongest Knight noble lineage in the world, this needs to be done right, all profiles need to be merged

Mike Stangel, can you address this situation please

Lord Bruce

My status is growing now, the world is changing the way we do things, seems like I have a big part in this change, lets make it happen together, Love Geni this has been very rewarding, Thank you Mike and all curators for your dedication to making this right, Thank you all

9/22/2021 at 1:44 PM

Maximilian was born at Wiener Neustadt on 22 March 1459. His father, Frederick III, Holy Roman Emperor, named him for an obscure saint, Maximilian of Tebessa, who Frederick believed had once warned him of imminent peril in a dream. In his infancy, he and his parents were besieged in Vienna by Albert of Austria. One source relates that, during the siege's bleakest days, the young prince wandered about the castle garrison, begging the servants and men-at-arms for bits of bread. The young prince was an excellent hunter, his favorite hobby was hunting for birds as a horse archer.

9/22/2021 at 2:05 PM

Maximilian has not been isolated. Maximilian has not been deleted. Maximilian is still in the Tree.

Maximilian I von Habsburg, Archduke of Austria, Emperor of the Holy Roman Empire of the German Nation

A duplicate profile of Maximilian was deleted, for reasons that have been explained.

If there is information that you believe should be included in the Master Profile which is not there, it can be added.

The deleted profile cannot be merged in, even if we wanted to merge it in, which we don’t, because it is gone.

Best to focus on the profile of Maximilian which is here.

9/23/2021 at 10:27 AM

Speaking for Geni and Customer Service: Anne and Sharon have it exactly right. There's really no further explanation necessary; fictional and mythological figures are isolated; real people remain in the big tree. Where these mythological trees should interface with actual historical figures, we recommend placing explanatory links in the About text.

Deletion of duplicates is a different issue. The problem there is that everyone wants to build their tree back to Charlemagne, but medieval genealogy is hard and few get it fully correct. The existing profiles have been vetted by our curators and cultivated over many years; they represent the best information we have about those lines. No offense, but I don't want your Charlemagne; we've already got one and it's very nice. Merging duplicates every day and resolving discrepancies (both in profile data and relationships / tree structure) is fruitless busy-work. That's why our curators are authorized to merge at the lowest overlapping profile and then disconnect the top to be deleted.

Private User
9/23/2021 at 11:56 AM

Mike Stangel -

Is there any requirement that Isolation and deletion only be used for Trees extending into the Medieval Era?
(According to one source, "The medieval era, often called The Middle Ages or the Dark Ages, began around 476 A.D. following a great loss of power throughout Europe by the Roman Emperor. The Middle Ages span roughly 1,000 years, ending between 1400 and 1450")

If not, the next time someone uploads Trees with duplicates of my relatives, can I ask that it be isolated and deleted?.or what are the guidelines?

9/23/2021 at 2:16 PM

Private User No, it's not a strict requirement. The decision whether to merge and resolve, or isolate and delete, lies with the curator. If you see a duplicate tree that appears to add no value, you can request assistance from a curator in the "Attention Curators, Please Assist" thread at https://www.geni.com/discussions/216411

As with all requests, please keep in mind that curators are volunteers with limited time and limited scope on what they can and cannot do with private profiles.

9/23/2021 at 8:33 PM

Mike my point is that profile I listed is 1400's it was isolated and now deleted the German spelling of the name the real profile, can we get the profile merged please, this are the same, the now deleted one, you are in charge and you can instruct the curators will do what you say,

Please merger the 2 I posted

Thank you

Lord Bruce de UBC

9/24/2021 at 1:50 AM

If you want the name on the MP of Maximilian I von Habsburg, Archduke of Austria, Emperor of the Holy Roman Empire of the German Nation updated in the German field, Request Management and add a German language tab where you can enter it; or message the Curator, Private User to do it for you.

As we have said a lot above and elsewhere: the way to add to profiles in the historical tree is not to create and try have duplicates merged in: it is to Request to be added as a manager, and work together with the other managers and Curators on the existing profile.

9/30/2021 at 8:47 AM

I asked and nothing, the name change is nothing without the merger on the German spelling of this profile to be merged into this person, they are of the same, facts is the same person, he is human, lol please merge

Lord de UBC

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