Rice Pudding Part 2, Quest For Truth

Started by John Smith on Friday, October 25, 2013
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W: Something you said yesterday caused me to go back to check & verify the Churchille Foote to Mary Hall connection....Im doing verification work on that as I have Many BUCKs in the family at Elizabeth Churchill 1642 & Henry Buck....(was Buckingham) also listed in the Geni collection....Now Im not clear about what I thought was the straight line to the Churchills....Will advise...Regards...DCR

Thanks to Dale and "W" for the discussion. Even as an abject novice I agree with "W" regarding our journey, quest for truth, and life is too short for snarkieness, to coin a word. I find I spend far too much time on Geni.com and those profiles that it indicates are related to my insignificant self. Like Dale, Geni links me to Winston Churchill and Queen Elizabeth. So, consequently, I am related to Dale as well (http://www.geni.com/path/James+Fothergill+is+related+to+Dale+C+Rice...). I am more closely related to Queen Elizabeth II (http://www.geni.com/path/James+Fothergill+is+related+to+Queen+Eliza...)
It is great fun! But, alas, verification is the game. Statistics and genealogy as well, it turns out. One web source (everything is true on the web, right?) has 150 million of us being able to trace our ancestry to William the Conqueror. How royal can that be? Still fun, though.

Dale - I've done a LOT of "Buck" families of Connecticut clean up.

Their origin in England is NOT proven, only speculated. Nor does the name derive from Buckingham.

But there's more than one Buck family so be sure and post an @ profile to where you might be unsure. Remember our old deal? I'm no England expert so I defer to better head's on that. But I'm getting decent for NEW England (still no expert!)

The Mayor of London during Henry Tudor Era is a Warren Christopher Warren, of Ashburton to George Hastings, 8th Earl of Huntingdon also connect to Foote as you will see. I have Mary Hall Foote to Elizabeth CHurchill Unknown Profile and Im wondering if Im right or if I needd to look at Margaret Margaret Woodville, Countess of Arundell sister to Elizabeth......one of them is the actual connection....but when I was doing my early work I had unknown foote and unknown Hall.....I just need to put in the first name and be sure about it....I feel sick. DCR

One error due to a glass of wine. I should have said "Statistics and genetics . . ." instead of genealogy.

Very Nice to see you here James: The Quest is dizzying, and where it may lead is anyones guess........Im a newbie on operations but have a fair grasp of the persons involved after my year online and scanning the families....DCR

Dale Unknown Profile is a private and living profile. No one can see it but you.

This is the Master Profile for Elizabeth Churchill

When you're ready, merge your profile into it.

Then please note the curator note that floats on top of this period

Josiah Churchill, of Wethersfield

It reads: parents unproven

Erica, I was able to Verify the JOHN Hall & Elizabeth Foote connection and daughter Mary Elizabeth Hall JUne 12, 1769 . Mary Hall married my 2nd Great Grandfather William Rice Jr. 1761. William Rice, Jr. This line comports with the Mayor of London Christopher Warren, of Ashburton and the Foote lineage....That's settled. What makes me uneasy is where we have Foote to Churchill. Josiah Churchill is really unknown parentage Unknown Profile but Mary Churchill Unknown Profile is a sister to Elizabeth? DCR 1948

Dale again you @ linked a private profile only you can see. Please @ link the public profiles - all notes are within those profiles if you open them up to the full profile view.

Okay, I thought I made it all public....do I have to go to each one?

I am going to EACH file and opening if it's closed...This may take a bit as there are 160 people in the Rice Family...fyi sorry....for the Duhhh moment.

Dale - I want you to @ link not your profiles, but the one's that long preceded you (and me) on Geni.

Most of them are Master Profiles; and if you open them up to the full profile view, you will often see external links and notes contributed by the research of many.

In addition there may be documents attached to lend validity and credibility to their tree placement.

So that is what we need to look at - the work of many.

Dale....it is easier to go to HOME page....to FAMILY....then LISTS...

It will give you all your profiles and you can go from one to the other to make any 'deceased' profiles 'public'.

I've done all of them that I can...Thanks FAY....DCR

Sometimes the simple tasks that are housekkeepping chores cause big issues down-line....You made the task simple F. B. and fyi...if one uses the @ symbole to link....it's wont do it unless there is a space before the symbol and none after....It's all in the wrist....I know....LOL

Yes, I understand....the MP show more useful data than my links to my family, I do understand that....I also was trying to show the linkage....as that's the whole point of the @ .....so now that we have shared a tutorial that would have been useful a year ago...Perhaps GENI can arrange a little 3 minute how to before thowing the PUBLIC into the deep waters here at GENI...just a suggestion since I will hardly be the last person to join up....yes? DCR

My hope is that my PUBLIC TRAINING is of use others here as well....Im all about getting er Done....as Ian is fond of saying....sometimes, one does not know what they don't know....and I intend no criticisim of the site whatsoever...but it's been a longer grind than perhaps it should be....W....I still don't seem to be able to call up names in the PEOPLE window unless I first find them through another's post in Blue and mark them as Follow....???DCR

It's been a year since I began....so I'ts my fault for not asking for help, but I didn't know what to ask either.....Sooooo, when I put George III in people Window after clicking the triangle I get no response...or any person not being followed no response....guidance is welcome here...DCR

Dale you make a great point and I do thank you for your good cheer in being the public student.

Geni is in some ways very simple, & is well designed to jump right in & start a tree. But each profile can be layered and dense; you'll be amazed at how powerful a tool it can be showing even one person. Timeline, events, schooling, relationships, uploaded documents, image gallery, external links, personal essays, membership in projects to show historical context and events, scholarly citations ... I've seen some beauties that are like little movies.

I sit in AWE of the continuing Power of the site: The person responsible are clearly in another realm of existence to be able to THINK through processes and connections in DEDUCTIVE ways....I will say that INDUCTIVE logic is also at work here on a daily baisis...and if one situation is affirmed by 6 different cross references using the possibility of being wrong....that can lead to a leap of insight that Einsteine Called the most powerful force in the UNIVERSE: Creativity...the developers here have shown that in spades....in my view....DCR1948

Just dont forget that those people that are living are by most people set as 'private' which means THEY can see them but others can only see that there is a profile there but only see first initial and last name....and canNOT access it.....

Altho you have the right to set up to a certain range of close relatives as 'private' most users set anyone who is deceased as 'public'....(outsider data is therefore restricted to info from obits, or census (and the most recent census available is the 1940 census).

Most people also build in 'tree view' but enter 'about me' data in 'profile' view......it is WISE to have some brief bio info in each profile.....(in the event of any mis-merges or confusion, the data you have entered is right there to clarify any situation which could arise)......and the further you go into building your tree you will find that the re-use of names within families will present a problem IF you dont have some way to tell them apart...

Geni is powerful, but there are curatorial issues. One is people not using the discussion tab. Another is curators who have started lines and curate lines they have a vested interest in not being responsive to inquiries from other members who have documentation that disproves or otherwise changes lineages. Then there are curators who simply respond not at all, even after a year or more.
Putting additional historical info in a profile is very useful when the names are the same. Adding their allegiances and motivations is an excellent way to find where the missing link is.
A final issue: those who create profiles based on " legends" from Burkes. Several times I have seen where the phrase " it is said that this family or that descends from so and so " . Well, good for them, but fake pedigrees didn't start with the Victorians. It might be a good place to start looking but usually when I see this it's a red flag - look for the linking documents. What is the Geni protocol on that? At least a curatorial note?

I would caution any newcomer from working too far back on their tree....follow (by all means) but get your 'sea-legs' under you closer to home at first.....ask questions....cultivate collaborators of people that you may find on a discussion that make sense to you or work areas of the country that you are also familiar with (they need not all be related closely).....follow discussions (Attention Curators is a good one).

Learn to maneuver before getting too ambitious......and REMEBER that tree matches are only POTENTIAL matches....99% are not the exact same people....and declining them only puts them back into the queue to wait till they find a home.

Would be nice if I remembered how to spell remember.

And there are still a lot missing.

No possibility to add sources to a marriage.
No possibility to add when people get engaged.
No possibility to add events without using Timeline, in my opinion the events should be added in the Edit screen.

And then you have have the big lack of possibities to add different alternative names like name in censuses, name(s) after being married, farmnames, soldiernames and so on (the list is long).

Geni, still has a long way to go to become as good as most offline genealogical software when it comes to some of the basic and important tools and possibilities a genealogical software should have. I only hope that these issues will be in the forefront of what Geni will implement in the near future,

OK we're getting really off topic here.

Can we let this one discussion be as titled - RICE Pudding Part 2?

I thank everyone for the consideration.

Dale C. Rice

I think where we were was looking at the family of Josiah Churchill, of Wethersfield

This is my thought.

Let's review the notes in the "overview" (select "profile" in tree view to open it up and see them).

Then we can examine the evidence that links him - or not - as you're hoping.

The Foote family (his wife) is better documented to England is my understanding.

From the notes I gathered that Josiah's Father was not known....which was a suprise because my impression last March was that John Churchill was in his lineage....that's what brought me up short....I did verify that JOHN was the name of the father of Mary Hall Rice which then puts me square in front of Elizabeth Churchill because it's Hall to Foote to Churchill....DCR1948

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