Donald J. Trump, 45th President of the USA - Were you once connected to Donald J. Trump and now you're not?

Margaret Cameron Supposedly has a burial place.

The 1851 census is uploaded to that family, no John McLeod.

Dear Private User and Erica Howton,

Could we please unlock the relationships for Ann MacKenzie and her husband.

I see that she was disconnected from her supposed parents, John MacKenzie and Catherine Beaton. I believe that I have found her real parents, which according to her death certificate were Malcolm Mackenzie and Christina Macrae. See here: https://media.geni.com/p13/80/78/99/5f/5344484ca9ba88cc/scotlandspe...

This should be the profile for her father: Malcolm Mackenzie

Christina Macrae is a link to the Forbes line! That would be interesting.

private How is she a link to a Forbes family?

A few month's back I was connected to Mr. Trump....now I am not....maybe because I live in South Africa?

Tamás Flinn Caldwell-Gilbert Done, great find.

Tamás Caldwell-Gilbert, Do you know how to use the pushpin feature?

Start here:
→ Sir Alexander de Forbes, 1st Lord of Forbes
→ James Forbes, 2nd Lord of Forbes his son
→ William "Gray Willie" Forbes, 3rd Lord Forbes his son
→ John Forbes, 6th Lord Forbes his son
→ Hon. Elizabeth Forbes his daughter
→ John Grant of Freuchie her son
→ Barbara MacKenzie his daughter
→ Kenneth Mackenzie, 1st of Kintail her son
→ Sibyl Mackenzie his daughter
→ Anne Fraser her daughter
→ Mary Mackenzie her daughter
→ John Macleod, 9th of Raasay her son
→ Janet Macleod his daughter
→ Christina Macrae her daughter

Tamás Caldwell-Gilbert, there may be another Christina Macrae. Would you give me her profile link please? Or that of Malcom's? Thanks!

How do we reconcile these records?

https://www.geni.com/photo/view/6000000055952632939?album_type=phot...

Marriage of Donald MacLeod and Margaret Cameron

https://www.geni.com/documents/view?doc_id=6000000097678168174&

Death of Margaret MacLeod, daughter of John and Mary MacLeod, married woman

Margaret Cameron

Was she born out of wedlock and went by both mother and father surname?

“https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Macleod-2061 Lists her as Margaret McLeod (Daughter of John Macleod and Mary (Cameron) Macleod) based on a family tree in the Macleod family. Also seen at https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/family/M91G-461”

Or a person mixup ?

Ahh, you are referring to this Christina Macrae, Christina Macrae.

The "History of the Macleods with genealogies of the principle families of the name..." (page 384 bottom of the first paragraph), says that Christina Macra "died unmarried." This is therefore not the Christina Macrae that married Malcolm Mackenzie. https://archive.org/stream/historyofmacleod00mack#page/384/mode/2up

This is exactly the kind of matchmaking which I cautioned against at length previously. The fact that a Christina Macrae existed does not imply that it is the same Christina Macrae as the one we are looking at. To provide an example: a search for birth records for c* macrae between 1780-1800 in the Ross and Cromarty county alone returns at least 4 different Christian/Christina (not to mention multiple Catherine and Katherine) Macraes, none of whom are the Christina Macrae which you mentioned. We cannot create family trees by matching people with similar names together, that is not an evidenced based, academic approach to research. This is exactly the kind of family tree making which leads to the sorts of erroneous connections that we have been disconnecting.

I would also like to bring up the point which Erica Howton raised. When we look at Ann Mackenzie (the daughter of Christina Macrae) and her family, we see that Ann Mackenzie was listed as a pauper in the 1881 census, her parents were crofters (small farmers), and her son, John, was an illiterate (signed Ann Mackenzie’s death certificate with an 'X') fisherman. Such a family, living in abject poverty (pauper) and illiterate are probably not immediate members of a wealthy, land-holding, elite family.

I don't mean to come across as divisive, but accuracy and proper methodology in genealogical research is a topic which I feel quite strongly about.

Sincerely,
Tamas :)

Sorry private I did not see your most recent message while writing my response. Here is the other Christina ‘Kirsty’ Macrae.

Erica Howton I was just about to post about Margaret Cameron. The death record I posted corresponds to the death date listed on Geni (January 24, 1859).

Without the presence of birth records for Catherine/Christian MacLeod I am not sure how we can know what the names of her parents actually were. She married William MacLeod before 1841 (the first census year in Scotland), so I am not sure where we can draw that connection from in the first place (the marriage certificate does not name parents either). I have faith that our friends at NEHGS have done the proper research but I would like to see some evidence and I think that we should reach out to them about this question if possible. I think that we might be able to find that evidence by tracking down the death certificate for Catherine/Christian, but I do not have the necessary funds to buy the death certificates for all of the many possible Catherine/Christian Macleods in the area in the hope that the correct death record exists.

It could also be that the death date previously listed on Geni is wrong and therefore the death certificate is for another Margaret MacLeod/Cameron, but I am not sure. As for the born out of wedlock option it is always a possibility but that is not an assumption which I think that we can make.

Tamás Caldwell-Gilbert, I asked for the other "Christina Macrae" (and not Kirsty MacKenzie). I also asked for the profile you are referencing 'Malcolm Mackenzie."

Private User so given Tamas’ comments, and the ambiguity of the NEHGS entry:

Bannerman, Alexander, Julie Helen Otto and Gary Boyd Roberts. "The ancestry of President Donald John Trump: an initial investigation." American Ancestors 18, no. 1 (Spring 2017): 50-1. https://www.americanancestors.org/uploadedfiles/media/american_ance... (accessed June 26, 2019). “25. Christian/Catherine MacLeod (b. Stornoway ca. 1809), daughter of Donald MacLeod and Margaret Cameron”

(Listing them as parents but not actually profiling them as of March 2017), how should we best present this on Geni?

I’m thinking we could “break” with link backs in profiles and continue to build possibly - related trees. Often obscure relationships become clearer by simply expanding families.

private Here they are Malcolm Mackenzie and Christina ‘Kirsty’ Macrae. The Kristy Mackenzie i sent you is a profile for what I think are the same people in another tree, I have requested merges for the two of them. I assume that Christina/Kristy are the same name. Like Katherine and Kate.

The pending merge: https://www.geni.com/merge/compare/6000000097683327119?from%5Fflash...

Erica, I have been working on this for quite awhile and my eyeballs are falling out. Take a look and see if it passes muster, please. My goodness, there are a lot of Macs in Scotland!! I have to check on our front yard to see if our 600-pound visitor is here yet--old Black Bear with a bad back leg, and does he love bird seed!!

Susan Angeline Schumacher Lostetter Looks great, and you kept them unconfused. Hope you get the bear baffled, though. :)

Thank you, we can see the different households better now.

Are you guys SURE the tree for Malcom MacKenzie and Kirsty MacRae is correct? Kirsty would have been only 12yrs. old when she gave birth to son John.

===References
*http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/ Statutory deaths, 1886 ref. 088/79.. Anne MacLeod (widow of Alexander MacLeod, crofter), died May 24, 1886, at Aird of Tong, Stornoway. Age 75. Parents: Malcolm Mackenzie, crofter (deceased), and Christian Mackenzie m.s. Macrae (deceased). Cause: infirmities of old age. Informant: John MacLeod, son, present.

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/sources/L72Z-ZR2 Has dates 1773 - 1845, of Branahuie, Ross and Cromarty, Scotland, for Christina Macrae.

Diana, indeed there are many Malcoms that fit in the date range:

#1: Malcom MacKenzie 1766-1845
Malcolm Mackenzie
Husband of Kirsty Mackenzie
Christina ‘Kirsty’ Macrae

#2: Malcom McKenzie: 1742-1836
Malcolm McKenzie

Husband of Catherine McKenzie
Catherine MacKenzie

#3: Malcom McKenzie Birth estimated between 1702 and 1760
Malcolm McKenzie

Husband of Katharine McKenzie
Katharine McKenzie

#4: Malcolm McKenzie (McKinzie) circa 1785
Malcolm McKenzie (McKinzie)

The one requested by Tamas looks like the right family (I viewed his tree). Let’s give the manager, who is active, a chance to respond.

Donald J Trump Pedigree from American Ancestors 18.1 page 51 2017
https://www.geni.com/photo/view/6000000007106626344?album_type=phot...

Click on the Full size button to see this clearly or download it.

Note this was published as "preliminary."

private #2 is from Perth and Kinross County, #3 from Highland in Scotland, #4 from Iowa/Kentucky, USA

We also need to keep in mind geographical distances when finding corresponding matches. The families which we are researching for Trumps ancestry, including Malcolm Mackenzie and Christine Macrae, come from around Stornoway, a town on an island in the north of Scotland.

I believe that the tree which Erica Howton mentioned has the correct birth dates. We also see the birth date of circa 1773 for Christina Mackenzie, wife of Malcolm, on the 1841 census in Branahuie. I believe that the 1783 birth date here on Geni is probably a mistake.

As for the death dates (1845), I think that they are most likely estimates, probably close for Malcolm who is not on the 1851 census with Christina, but Christina appears to live a bit longer than that.

As for the sources for the birth estimates for of Malcolm mentioned in this discussion:https://www.geni.com/discussions/198201?msg=1307079
I did not add those. Those estimates are done automatically by geni based on the birth dates of the children in order to give you a rough idea of when they lived if no information is added.

Here is the 1878 death certificate for the John Mackenzie, son of Malcolm and Christina, which lists the parents as Malcolm Mackenzie and Christina Macrae: https://www.geni.com/documents/view?doc_id=6000000097720034861&

The parish of Stornoway in County Ross and Cromarty is what we’re looking for in this tree.

See https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/sct/ROC/Stornoway

https://www.hebrideanconnections.com/locations/204

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comhairle_nan_Eilean_Siar

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Stornoway,_Ross_and_Cromarty,_...

“Two eminent characters were born in this parish, Sir Alexander M’Kenzie of Avoch, celebrated for his travels and discoveries on the continent of North America; and Colonel Colin M’Kenzie of the East India Company’s service, distinguished for his writings, and research into the antiquities of India.”

“The only landowner in the parish is James A. Stewart M’Kenzie, Esq. of Seaforth, M.P.; he married the oldest daughter of the Late Lord Seaforth, and has a large family.”

“The population in 1750 was 1836, and by 1831, it is numbered as 5491.”

Well, Erica, I did all of the folks as you asked me to. I was extending the families of John and Donald as they were not complete. All of a sudden, some of my work is GONE. I did not delete it and I don't know who did or where it went. https://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=lewisandother... I was going to connect https://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=lewisandother...
where she belonged, but she disappeared from my screen. I guess I am finished with the project as I don't know where to go with it.

Here’s Murdo MacLeod who married Ann McKenzie

https://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=lewisandother...

This a different Murdo MacLeod but likely related. It’s an isolated / abandoned tree. If anyone finds a match or genealogy connection, let a curator know.

Can someone PLEASE post on here the profile for an Angus Macleod (1752-1843) married a Catherine (may be Maclean) managed by Carol Anne Ord?