Query on children of William OXLEY

https://australianroyalty.net.au/individual.php?pid=I83069&ged=...
William OXLEY (1811-1893)
married Sarah WELLS (1816-1886)
* 1836 James Oxley WELLS born 20/12/1836 baptised 27/12/1836
* 1839 Sarah OXLEY born 10/2/1839 baptised 3/3/1839
* 1840 Thomas OXLEY
* 1844 William OXLEY born 2/1/1844 baptised 10/1/1844
* 1846 Robert - V18463478 31A/1846 OXLEY ROBERT WILLIAM SARAH
* 1849 Eliza Jane born 9/3/1849 baptised 25/3/1849
* 1851 Rebecca - V18512326 38A/1851 OXLEY REBECCA WILLIAM SARAH
* 1854 Joseph - V18541336 155/1854 OXLEY JOSEPH WILLIAM SARAH
* 1857 Mary Ann - 6720/1857 OXLEY MARY A WILLIAM SARAH GOULBURN
* 1858 John
* 1864 Susan - 8649/1864 OXLEY SUSAN WILLIAM SARAH GOULBURN

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Oxley-890
William OXLEY (1812-1893)
married Sarah WELLS (1816-1886)
* 1839 Sarah
* 1840 Thomas
* 1844 William David
* 1846 Robert
* 1851 Rebecca
* 1854 Joseph
* 1857 Mary Ann
* 1860 John
* 1861 Eliza
* 1864 Susan Ann

THOMAS OXLEY born in 1837 in England cannot be the son of William OXLEY and Sarah WELLS who were in Australia at this time.

3 x Johns

John Oxley
* born 1845 Goulburn
* died 9/6/1942 Cowra

John Oxley
* born 1858 Goulburn

John Oxley
* born 1860 Goulburn
* died 9/6/1942
* married Margaret Oxley

NSW Baptism Record - John OXLEY born 28/2/1860, baptised 5/12/1860 Wagga Wagga, father William OXLEY, mother Sarah

Australia Cemetery Inscriptions - John OXLEY, born 1860, died 9/6/1942 Woodstock, Tasmania, Australia

2 x Robert's

Robert Oxley
* born 5/7/1846 Victoria
* died 1924 Binalong, NSW
* married Martha Marcia Oxley (1861-1943)

Robert Oxley
* born 1859 Australia
* died 10/5/1924 Boorowa, NSW

NSW Birth Record 3478/1846 V18463478 31A - Robert OXLEY, father William, mother Sarah

Victoria Birth Record 14996/1846 - Robert OXLEY, father William OXLEY, mother Sarah - Melbourne

NSW Death Record 9370/1924 - Robert OXLEY, 77yrs, Boorowa

2x Eliza's

Eliza Jane Huntington
* born 9/3/1849 Melbourne
* married Private
* died 1887 St Leonards

Eliza Hahn
* born 1861 Carcoar
* died 5/4/1907 Tuena

NSW Marriage Record 489/1872 - John Barker HUNTINGTON married Eliza J OXLEY - Sydney

If married HUNTINGTON in 1872 cannot be born in 1861

Victoria Birth Record 26309 / 1849 - Eliza Jane OXLEY, born Melbourne - father William OXLEY, mother Sarah

Several pieces of incorrect information in both the original data and the answers to the questions: For the record William (Convict) Oxley is my great, great, great, great grandfather.
#1. William was born in 1808 in Averham, Nottinghamshire, England. Most likely December.
#2. William had 11 children.
#3. The William born in 1837 in England is not his son.
#4. There is 1 illegitimate son missing. James Oxley Wells was born on 20 Dec 1836 before William & Sarah were married in 1837.
#5. Thomas Oxley. Correct birth year is 1841 not 1840.
#6. 2 x John's 1845 & 1858 are duplications. Only 1 son John and that was 1860
#7.William 1844 did not have a middle name. The inclusion of David is wrong.
#8 John Oxley 1860-1924 is not buried in Woodstock, Tasmania. He is buried in Woodstock NSW. Australia Cemetery inscriptions are wrong with that information. I have visited his grave site in Woodstock many times as a child and teenager when I visited my grandmother who lived there
#9.Eliza Jane Oxley (1849-1887) married John Barker Huntington.

correction to #2. Should be Thomas not William.

#1. I sited an official Nottinghamshire birth record for William, online, which clearly stated 1808. Unfortunately I didn't take a copy and have been searching continuously to find it again. So far no luck. He was definitely born in Averham, Nottinghamshire. He did have a nick name of Lincoln Billy, but as far as I've been able to ascertain, he got that when he left home and moved to Lincolnshire.
#3. I sent another message correcting that.
#5. I don't, but other direct descendants have been able to determine that 1841 is correct based on his age at death, viz 78.
#7. It's the wiki tree data that has David incorrectly.
#8. But you do under Australian Cemetery Inscriptions. I was pointing out that that source is incorrect.
#1. Some profiles show William's surname as being Oxby. That is incorrect for a couple of reasons. a. his parents were Thomas Oxley & Martha Oxley (born Mallenden). b. The poor handwriting on the documentation for his transportation to Oz at first glance looks like Oxby, but when zoomed in on it is actually Oxly. A combination of poor handwriting and bad spelling. Also with regards to William he was 84 when he died in Nov 1893, so that also means he had to be born in 1808, most likely December.

As I stated previously, I've sited online the official Nottinghamshire birth record for this particular William. Year of birth 1808, parents Thomas Oxley and Martha Oxley (born Mallenden). Age at death comes from a direct descendant (my cousin) who has visited his grave, where I'm told by that descendant that his age is stated on the headstone. So do the math. Died 15 Nov 1893 minus 84 = 1808/1809, but as the Nottinghamshire birth record I found clearly states 1808 as his birth year, that means he had to be born between 16th Nov 1808 & 31st December 1808.

I got back in touch with my cousin to confirm that he had seen William's age on his headstone. He retracted that statement as paupers graves did not have headstones, but he was adamant that William was 84 when he died based on information from his side of the family and the fact he saw the Nottinghamshire birth records when he was there 2 years ago and again earlier this year. William was his great,great grandfather.

I've sited his birth record online where it clearly states his parents are Thomas Oxley & Martha Oxley (born Mallenden). My cousin has been to Nottinghamshire TWICE and seen his birth record. It's your type of unwillingness to accept the facts that is one of the reasons I haven't uploaded my gedcom file ( 1400 people ) to Geni, PLUS teh fact that I see so many Geni profiles with wrong data. So if that wrong data can be readily accepted and not questioned why can't you accept actual facts. I've also been in contact with people on the Mallenden side and tehy also confirm from their research that William was born in 1808 and that his parents were Thomas Oxley & martha Oxley ( born Mallenden ) . So why is it so hard for you to accept that we are right in what has be stated and that you are just being stubborn for the sake of it.

A few problems...

The William Oxley with parents Thomas and Martha was baptized in 1813
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818855ee93790eca344630f/...
It is most unlikely in this era that a birth date (as opposed to a baptism date) would be recorded. A January 1st date usually raises a red flag in most family tree systems as being a default.

Yes, Martha's maiden name was Mallender
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/58184c24e93790eb7f89fe4f/...

A further problem: Averham is nowhere near Carlton-in-Lindrick.

None of this seems relevant. The only verifiable evidence is that William was born in Lincolnshire - he was simply tried in Nottinghamshire.

While it can't be proven one way or the other, his most likely origin seems to be
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818a586e93790ec8be309a0/...

Leanne are you incapable of understanding the details I have given you.

#1. I have sited online William's Nottinghamshire birth details. Year of birth 1808. Parents Thomas Oxley and Martha Oxley ( born Mallenden )
#2. My cousin has made 2 trips to the UK with the specific purpose of those trips to verify Williams year of birth and who his parents were. They have sited William's birth record which clearly shows the same information that I sited online.
#3. As per Elaine's comment, William was baptised in 1813 in Carlton in Lindrick Both parents clearly listed as previously stated.
#4. Elaine, Averham is only 30 miles ( 48kms ) from Carlton in Lindrick, so not that far, especially as baptism was almost 5 years after the birth. That is strange, but not unusual for the time.
#5. In 1828 when transported William was 19. That makes his birth year 1808
#$6.In 1837 when married he was 29. That makes his birth year 1808.
#7. Living relatives that I've contacted know from family history that William was 84 when he died in Nov 1893.. That makes his birth year 1808.
#8. The family has pretty much always known that we were descendants of a convict
#9. No record can be found of another William Oxley be transported to Australia as a convict.
#10. Sometimes you need to accept the word of those that have done the research, especially in this case my cousin who has gone to great lengths and at great personal expense, to seek out the information.
#11. Elaine the William in your link, born in Lincolnshire is NOT my great, great, great., great grandfather. This has also been verified by my cousin on his 2nd visit to the UK.

So Leanne, unless you can give me irrefutable proof contradicting all our research then stop with your stubbornness and accept that as direct descendants we know better than you.

These are the baptisms of Thomas' and Martha's children.

George OXLEYBaptism28 Aug 1798NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
Mary OXLEYBaptism28 Dec 1800NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
Sarah OXLEYBaptism15 Nov 1805NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
Sarah OXLEYBaptism17 May 1807NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
Hannah OXLEYBaptism24 Sep 1809NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
Thomas OXLEYBaptism23 Sep 1810NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
William OXLEYBaptism31 May 1813NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
John OXLEYBaptism05 Feb 1816NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
Mary OXLEYBaptism17 May 1817NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John
Fanny OXLEYBaptism02 Aug 1818NottinghamshireCarlton in Lindrick : St John

If William was born in 1808, why were his siblings baptized ahead of him? Also, Averham doesn't feature in any of the siblings.

It seems to be a rock-solid family, unlike the bastard from Lincolnshire.

As Leanne mentions, you need to tie this Nottingham William to the convict - Lincolnshire is the most obvious at the moment.

calling you stubborn isn't attacking you, it's stating a fact. You are refusing to accept the information I'm giving you based on deep research done by living descendants of Willam (Convict) Oxley, especially the findings of my cousin who has travelled to the UK twice to deep dive William's history. I can tell you for certain that William WAS born in 1808, most likely between 16 Nov & 31 Dec. As for evidence you can see the baptism record below for yourself. Living descendants in the UK have not been able to shed any light on why there is almost 5 years between his birth and baptism. . William was NOT born in Lincolnshire that was a different William. His birth record shows Nottinghamshire as place of birth, but no town or city. As I said my cousin sited birth records for William on both visits to the UK, I've sited his birth record online after stumbling onto it, but have not been able to find it again. I'm still searching. My cousin was also able to establish that William moved to Lincolnshire when he left home at a young age and his nic name was Lincoln Billy. I think you need to accept that the direct descendants that have done the research know better than you, and you need to cease your little power trip. Remember you are only a volunteer, not an expert.
See baptism record below.

Name William Oxley
Gender Male
Christening May 31 1813
Carlton In Lindrick, Nottingham, England
Father Thomas Oxley
Mother Martha
Indexing Project (Batch) Number C04641-1
System Origin England-ODM
GS Film number 504061, 504087

Firstly, I agree with regards to Rhonda's work being very well researched. At least that's one thing we can agree on. If you have read all of Rhonda's document on William Oxley thoroughly you will note in the very last sentence on William's story that she makes it abundantly clear that William was 84 when he died on 15th Nov 1893. So that makes his year of birth 1808, which also means the age of 17 in the newspaper article is wrong. However, you can't just take internet trees as being correct. In many instances they are not even remotely correct with some people, especially in Geni. I know about that William & Sarah but that is a different William Oxley, which my cousin was able to prove on his last visit to the UK.That is the William & Sarah in the 1871 census, so it can't be William (Convict) as he was in Australia then (transported in 1828). Thomas Oxley & Martha Oxley (born Mallender) actually had 8 children.
1. George Oxley - born 1798 - died ?
2. Mary Oxley - born 1800 - died 1804
3. Sarah Oxley - born 1805 - died 1806
4. William Oxley - born 1808/1809 - died 15 Nov 1893 ( the convict transportation documents show his age as 19 and year of birth as 1809).
5. Hannah Oxley - born 1809 - died 1809 ( this actually ads to the fact that William was born in 1808 if you apply common logic
6. Thomas Oxley - born 1810 - died 1868
7. John Oxley - born 1815 - died 1816
8. Fanny Oxley - born 1818 - died ?

Did you actually check the information that you wrote before writing it? Obviously not. How could the William you're referring to that was married in 1836 in Nottinghamshire even be considered as William (Convict) when William (Convict) had already been in Australia for 8 years in 1836. You really should do some fact checking before coming back with outlandish replies like your last one especially when you're the one who keeps harping on about evidence. Perhaps you should practice what you preach.

Elaine, as I stated previously, There is no explanation for the almost 5 year gap between William (Convict's) birth and baptism. However, after further research, I now believe the William baptised in 1813 is the same William in the 1871 census and not William (convict). His parents were also William Oxley and Martha Oxley, but not Martha Mallender.

From the only available evidence William Oxley the convict hailed from Lincolnshire as in Albion's indent as noted by Rhonda Brownlow - "Number 137 Oxby or Oxley William, age 19 years, ticket of leave 1842/ 1191, education - nil, protestant, single, Place of Origin - Lincolnshire"

There is nothing tying the convicts birth to Nottinghamshire except that his offence occurred near Averham Nottinghamshire. Unless evidence is found to the contrary it appears to me that the birth location is fabricated to match this fact.

A William Oxley has been stumbled upon that vaguely matches the birthdate.
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818855ee93790eca344630f/...

Unfortunately this William Oxley married in 1836
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/58184c26e93790eb7f8a021e/...
so cannot be the Australian convict.

The one and only remaining piece of evidence gives the 1810 Lincolnshire birthplace
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818a586e93790ec8be309a0/...
whose bastardy probably explains his Nottingham relocation and conviction.

(The data is from parish register transcripts, not family trees)

Elaine, did you not read that I stumbled upon William (Convict) Oxley's birth record online, wherein it clearly states his parents as Thomas Oxley & Martha Oxley (born Mallender) and that his year of birth was 1808 in Nottinghamshire. Until I found that record I had no idea who his parents or siblings were. When I find it again, I'll post it and that will bring an end to this ridiculous debate.