Hilduin I d'Arcis-Sur-Aube, 1st comte de Montdidier, d’Arcis-sur-Aube et de Ramerupt

Is your surname d'Arcis-Sur-Aube?

Research the d'Arcis-Sur-Aube family

Hilduin I d'Arcis-Sur-Aube, 1st comte de Montdidier, d’Arcis-sur-Aube et de Ramerupt's Geni Profile

Share your family tree and photos with the people you know and love

  • Build your family tree online
  • Share photos and videos
  • Smart Matching™ technology
  • Free!

Hilduin I d'Arcis-Sur-Aube, 1st comte de Montdidier, d’Arcis-sur-Aube et de Ramerupt

Also Known As: "Hildouin I", "Of Montdidier", "Helpuin"
Birthdate:
Birthplace: Arcis-Sur-Aube, Aube, France
Death: before 956
Montdidier, Somme, Picardie, France
Immediate Family:

Son of Helpuin Unknown and Dame de Ramerupt Hersende d'Arcis sur Aube
Father of Hilduin II de Montdidier, count of Arcis-sur-Aube, seigneur de Ramerupt
Brother of Countess Hersinde "le Pieuse" de Ramerupt, Heiress de Montdidier, d’Arcis-sur-Aube et de Ramerupt

Occupation: Count of Arcis-sur-Aube
Managed by: Bo Garsteen
Last Updated:

About Hilduin I d'Arcis-Sur-Aube, 1st comte de Montdidier, d’Arcis-sur-Aube et de Ramerupt

Parents unknown. Wife and/or children unknown. Formerly thought to be the husband of Hersinde, but now believed to be her brother or brother-in-law.

From FMG Medieval Lands database:

SEIGNEURS de RAMERUPT

It has long been assumed that Hildouin I was the husband of Hersinde and the father of Hildouin II and Manasses, Bishop of Troyes.

However, Charles Cawley, in his Medieval Lands database, cites a transcription (see Tardif, 1866--available online) of the document "Donation faites par Philippe I, a l'Abbaye de Saint-Germain de Pres, du village de Bagneux, en echange de celui de Combs" dated 1061, in Latin. The document states that "Henri I King of France had regranted Combs [a village southeast of Paris, between Paris and Melun--PW] to "Manasses nepos supradicti Hilduini comitis" just as "suus avunculus Hilduinus" had held it, noting that "Odo comes filius prefati Manassetis" now claimed the property as held by "avunculus patris eius Hilduinus"[1211]."

This ambiguous placement of the Manasses in question as the nephew or grand-nephew of Hildouin puts new light on the relationship between Hildouin I and Hersinde, mother or grandmother of this Manasses. Based on this information as well as the statement by Ramerupt historian Arbois de Jubainville, who states that the name of Hersende´s husband is not known, Cawley suggests that Hersinde may have been Hildouin's sister or may have married an unnamed brother of Hildouin.

From FMG Medieval Lands database (November 2011):

SEIGNEURS de RAMERUPT

Two siblings:

1. HILDUIN [I] (-before 956). Comte [de Montdidier]. Philippe I King of France donated the village of Bagneux to the abbey of Saint-Germain-des-Prés in exchange for Combs by charter dated 1061, which recounts that "Hugonis ducis…magnus" [Hugues "le Grand"] had granted Combs to "Hilduino…comiti de Monte qui vocatur Desiderius", who died before his benefactor (i.e. before 956), and that Henri I King of France had regranted Combs to "Manasses nepos supradicti Hilduini comitis" just as "suus avunculus Hilduinus" had held it, noting that "Odo comes filius prefati Manassetis" now claimed the property as held by "avunculus patris eius Hilduinus"[1211].

2. brother/sister . On the basis of the charter dated 1061 which is quoted above, there are two possible identities for this brother/sister. If a brother, he was the husband of Hersend Dame de Ramerupt, mother of Hilduin [II] who is shown below. If a sister, she was Hersende herself. If the word "avunculus" in the document is given its strict interpretation of maternal uncle, the latter possibility would be correct. However, such relationship terms are not consistently used in their strict linguistic sense in medieval documents. In any case, from a chronological point of view, the term must indicate great-uncle in the 1061 document.

1. --- . Arbois de Jubainville states that the name of Hersende´s husband is not known, adding that "on suppose sans preuve que c´était Hilduin comte de Ponthieu"[1212]. As noted above, one possibility is that the husband of Hersende was the brother of Hilduin [I] who is shown above. m HERSENDE Dame de Ramerupt, daughter of ---. The Historia S. Balsemii records that "la comtesse…Hersende" transported the relics of St Baussenge from the priory of Saint-Pierre d´Arcis-sur-Aube to "son château de Ramerupt dans une église bâtie à ses frais, sous l´invocation de Notre-Dame"[1213]. As noted above, one possibility is that Hersende was the sister of Hilduin [I] who is shown above.

Two children of Hersinde:

a) HILDUIN [II] (-after [992/93]). The Historia S. Balsemii and the Historia S. Bercharii name "Hilduin comte d´Arcis" as the son of "la comtesse…Hersende"[1214]. Comte d´Arcis-sur-Aube. The Chronicle of Alberic de Trois-Fontaines names "comes de Arceis et de Ramerut…Hilduinus" as brother of "episcopi Manasse Trecensi", specifying that they were "de genere, ut dicitur, Ganalonis"[1215]. The reference to "Ganalo" has not been deciphered. Seigneur de Ramerupt. The Chronicle of Alberic de Trois-Fontaines records in [992/93] that "Adzo [abbas%E2%80%A6Dervensis monasterii]" [Adzon abbé de Montiérender] died "in peregratione transmarina", adding that he had taken with him "comitem Hilduinum de Arceis"[1216].

b) MANASSES (-991). The Chronicle of Alberic de Trois-Fontaines names "comes de Arceis et de Ramerut…Hilduinus" as brother of "episcopi Manasse Trecensi", specifying that they were "de genere, ut dicitur, Ganalonis"[1217]. Bishop of Troyes 970.

-------------------------------

Parents Unknown, but was possibly the son of Guillaume I de Ponthieu and Maude de St Pol de Thérouanne--SOURCES?

http://mypages.allwest.com/~rognan/genealogy/pafg902.htm

Helpuin Count Of Arcis-Sur-Aube-21724 was born in 930 in Of, Arcis-Sur-Aube, Aube, France. He died after 970 in Arcis-sur-Aube, Aube, France, France. He married Hersinde Countess Of Arcis-Sur-Aube [Dame Of Rameru]-21606 in 954 in , Ain, France, France.

Hersinde Countess Of Arcis-Sur-Aube [Dame Of Rameru]-21606 was born in 934 in Of, Rameru, Aube, France. She died in 970. She married Helpuin Count Of Arcis-Sur-Aube-21724 in 954 in , Ain, France, France.

They had the following children:

     		M 	i 	Hildouin II Count Montdidier [Seigneur Of Ram-21726 was born in 960. He died after 992.
     		F 	ii 	Godechilde de Ponthieu-91169 was born in 940. She died in 1005.
     		M 	iii 	Geoffrey I de Chateaudun Lord of Dunois-96162.

Hilduin I, Count of Montdidier
Hilduin I (died before 956), Count of Montdidier. It is unknown who the parents of Hilduin were. HIlduin was the founder of the House of Montdidier, which produced the Counts of Montdidier, Dammartin and Roucy.

There is considerable confusion as to the immediate family of Hilduin among historians and genealogists because of the lack of documented evidence, the preponderance of the names of Hilduin and Manasses in the family and the existence of other contemporary Hilduins (particularly, the Count of Montreuil).

The only creditable reference to Hilduin I was when Philip I, King of France, donated the village of Bagneux to the Abbey of Saint-Germain-des-Prés in exchange for Combs la Ville by charter dated 1061, which recounts that Hugh the Great had granted Combs to Hilduino…comiti de Monte qui vocatur Desiderius, who died before his benefactor (before 956), and that Henry I, King of France, had regranted Combs to Manasses nepos supradicti Hilduini comitis [Manasses, grandson of Hilduin] just as suus avunculus Hilduinus [his uncle Hilduin] had held it, noting that Odo comes filius prefati Manassetis [Odo, son of Manasses] now claimed the property.

Historians disagree as to the exact disposition of the descendants, but all agree that they descended from Hersende, Dame of Ramerupt, who was married to Hilduin I, or his son of the same name, or his brother, or, in some interpretations, his daughter. We cannot resolve these competing claims and will assume that Hilduin was married to Hersende (Heldwide). In 948, the first church in Montdidier, Somme, was built near the castle of Charlemagne by Hersende.

The count and his wife had two children:

Hilduin II, Count of Arcis-sur-Aube and Seigneur de Ramerupt Manasses (Manassé) (d. 991), Bishop of Troyes The next known Count of Montdidier was Hilduin III, grandson of Hilduin I. The apparent gap in the countship is unexplained.

A common mistake is to assume the Hugh I, Count of Ponthieu, husband of Gisele, daughter of Hugh Capet, was the son of Hilduin I, when, in fact, his father was Hilduin (Herluin), Count of Montreuil, as discussed by Flodoard.

Sources Edit

Tardif, J., Monuments historiques, Paris, 1866

Fanning, Steven and Bachrach, Bernard S. (translators), The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 919-966. Readings in Medieval Civilizations and Cultures 9. Broadview Press, 2004

Morton, Catherine, and Muntz, Hope (editors), The Carmen de Hastingae Proelio of Bishop Guy of Amiens, Oxford at the Clarendon Press, 1972

Medieval Lands Project, Seigneurs de Ramerupt, Comtes de Montdidier, Comtes d’Arcis-sur-Aube

Medieval Lands Project, Comtes de Montreuil

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilduin_I,_Count_of_Montdidier

view all

Hilduin I d'Arcis-Sur-Aube, 1st comte de Montdidier, d’Arcis-sur-Aube et de Ramerupt's Timeline

930
930
Arcis-Sur-Aube, Aube, France
956
956
Age 26
Montdidier, Somme, Picardie, France
????
Arcis Sur Aube, Aube, Grand Est, France
????