Joan Douglas

Are Mary Dacre and Joan Douglas the same person?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Douglas,_1st_Earl_of_Douglas#...

William Douglas, 1st Earl of Douglas & Mar is also said to have been the father of another illegitimate daughter, Joan Douglas, who married William Dacre, 5th Baron Dacre.[25]

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William Dacre, 5th Baron Dacre is said to have married Joan Douglas, illegitimate daughter of James Douglas, 2d Earl Douglas of Scotland. However the evidence is not clear. He did marry a “Mary” who was his widow.

Conflicting references

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/family/LZX8-HMF

“There is no proof that she was the daughter of William Douglas--illegitimate or otherwise.”

Plantagenet Ancestry: A Study In Colonial And Medieval Families, 2nd Edition ... page 612. < GoogleBooks > Joan, allegedly an illegitimate daughter of William Douglas, 1st Earl of Douglas, mother of Thomas Dacre, Knt., born 27 Oct. 1387.

http://www.cracroftspeerage.co.uk/online/content/dacre1321.htm

William [de Dacre], 5th Baron Dacre

• born c. 1357
• mar. Joan Douglas, illegit. dau. of James [Douglas], 1st Earl of Douglas
  • children
    • 1. Thomas de Dacre, later 6th Baron Dacre
    • 1. Joan de Dacre (b. 1374; d. 1456), mar. c 1397 Thomas Musgrave, of Hartley Castle (b. 1378; d. 3 Jan 1447), and had issue
• died 20 Jul 1399 (bur. in Lanercost Priory)
• suc. by son

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http://www.thepeerage.com/p1743.htm#i17421

William de Dacre, 5th Lord Dacre was born circa 1357.1 He was the son of Hugh de Dacre, 4th Lord Dacre and Elizabeth Maxwell.1 He married Mary (?)2 He died on 20 July 1399.1.

He succeeded as the 5th Lord Dacre [E., 1321] on 24 December 1383.1

Child of William de Dacre, 5th Lord Dacre

• Joan de Dacre+3 b. 1374, d. 1456

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http://www.thepeerage.com/p1743.htm#i17422

Mary (?) married William de Dacre, 5th Lord Dacre, son of Hugh de Dacre, 4th Lord Dacre and Elizabeth Maxwell.1 She was also known as Joan Douglas.2

Child of William de Dacre, 5th Lord Dacre and Mary (?)

• Thomas Dacre, 6th Lord Dacre+1 b. 27 Oct 1387, d. 15 Jan 1457/58

2. Mosley, Charles, editor. Burke's Peerage, Baronetage & Knightage, 107th edition, 3 volumes. Wilmington, Delaware, U.S.A.: Burke's Peerage (Genealogical Books) Ltd, 2003. BP2003 volume 1, page 1013.

https://www.stirnet.com/genie/data/british/dd/douglas01.php

• (2) William Douglas, 1st Earl of Douglas, Earl of Mar (d 1384) m. Margaret, Countess of Mar (b c1360, d by 19.10.1393, dau of Donald, 8th Earl of Mar)
  • (A) James Douglas, 2nd Earl of Douglas, Earl of Mar (dspl Otterburn 08.1388) m. Isabel Stewart (dau of Robert Stewart, King Robert II of Scots)
    • (v) Joan Douglas. A Joan of this generation is normally shown as wife of William de Dacre, 5th Lord. We provisionally show his wife as Mary of a generation earlier (see below).
  • (B) Isabella Douglas, Countess of Mar (dsp 1408) m1. (by 1388) Sir Malcolm Drummond (d 1402) m2. (1404) Alexander Stewart, Earl of Mar (dspl 1435)
  • (C) George Douglas, 1st Earl of Angus (d c1403) -- m. (1397) Mary Stewart (dau of John Stewart, King Robert III of Scots) -- partner(s) unknown
  • (D) Margaret Douglas (a 1404) m. Thomas Johnson
  • (E) Mary Douglas possibly of this family, of this generation m. William de Dacre, 5th Lord of Dacre and Multon (b 1357, d c1403)

References

• The Scots Peerage: 155 Joan is not listed as a daughter of William Douglas, 1st Earl of Mar
• https://our-royal-titled-noble-and-commoner-ancestors.com/p5166.htm... cites
• 1. [S4] Douglas Richardson, Royal Ancestry, Vol. II, p. 372.
• 2. [S4] Douglas Richardson, Royal Ancestry, Vol. III, p. 150.

www.findagrave.com

Joan Douglas Dacre
BIRTH unknown
Douglas, South Lanarkshire, Scotland
DEATH 1395
Brampton, City of Carlisle, Cumbria, England
BURIAL
Burial Details Unknown
MEMORIAL ID 194283418

Family Members
Spouse
William Dacre
1357–1399

Children
Thomas Dacre
1387–1458